Guess what’s happening here? Democrats might wonder why Tim Kaine did not press Mike Pence for his homophobic, anti-woman, right-wing record and rhetoric. Then, consider that Pence repeatedly dodged opportunities to defend Trump. Perhaps Team Clinton went easy on Pence because they know he means to undermine Trump and run himself in 2020. Forget this campaign. It’s over. Time to plan for reelection. When your opponent thinks two steps ahead, think three steps ahead.
“Perhaps Team Clinton went easy on Pence because they know he means to undermine Trump and run himself in 2020. Forget this campaign. It’s over. Time to plan for reelection.”
ah ha! thanks for that insight, boss, you solved the mystery. now we know who leaked the tax stuff: Veep throat
like mccain’s vp, trump is the classic definition of a rogue elephant.
an elephant or other large wild animal driven away or living apart from the herd and having savage or destructive tendencies.
pence stayed with the herd last night and started his prez run for 2020. trump has kept pence close to him for that reason as I am sure they really can’t stand each other or bother to defend each other. Keep your enemies close.
Ah- there’s our brilliant Craig! Thanks for that- had no idea.
the trump claim that he surrounds himself with the best? His kids set him up with pence…his lawyers can’t get their vanity foundation paperwork together…his tax attornies pays fines to buy more time…trump corporate support bleeds into the campaign defying election laws…his wife is the poster child for plagiarism and laziness.
Last night? Kaine was channeling his inner-Brannigan bros.
veep throat…good one, patd.
the dems may have noticed pence at the first debate…first of all, he attended and he walked-in like he was walking onto a yacht and starred in about 500 selfies with audience before the main event.
Craig. you are correct. Exactly what I thought last night.
Pence was a right wing talking points extraordinaire last night. He could not defend Trump properly without looking crazy, so he obviously chose to look after his own interests.
Pence definitely launched his Presidential Exploratory last night
Pence Exploratory Committee Party of One
Agree that Pence was setting himself up for a 2020 run. I agree with eprof… This debate won’t amount to a hill of beans for this election.
Going to explore the Rachel Carson Wildlife Refuge today. Cheers!
So Chertof endorsed Hillary. She advocated for Syrian no fly zone that Obama did not accept, has better and stronger stances on Iran and Russia. Who’d a thunk it?
Oh, and for what it is worth, I found Pense to be an offensive lying prick. Perfect running mate for drumpf.
tim kaine last night not so much the happy warrior but the jolly leprechaun.
btw, was surprised to see that kaine is taller. 1st time picture of them standing together. probably why drumpf campaign wanted them sitting. also noticed when drumpf was vetting veeps they were all shorter than he.
speaking of height, interesting that pence kept referring to putie as that ‘small and bullying leader’ … that’ll have repercussions.
bw, thanks. actually, the x-wives who might have been on those 1040s as joint filers, an unhappy scion or the deranged don himself were my first choices for leaker until fearless leader’s observation of the inchoate 2020 campaign. so veep throat, it must be he.
Pence also borrowed a quote last night.
It wouldn’t have been he–tremendous risk of being caught with subsequent likelihood of tragic fatal accident.
corey, good find. perfect.
I had to make that meme. But, it sounded like something Yogi would have said. 🙂
ny mag: Trump’s VP Debate Live-Tweeting Was Overseen by Staffers. It Was Still Weird.
Bill KristolVerified account @BillKristol 31m31 minutes ago
I’ve been critical of @GovPenceIN as VP candidate, but I do want to congratulate him for throwing @realDonaldTrump under the bus last night.
Pence not only threw his boss under the bus but he tossed Ted Cruz under the wheels as well. Once Trump loses, Pence lays claim to every single far right, Evangelical crazy member of the GOP without being burdened by the KKK & Nazi elements in the Deplorable Basket. That will make him a formidable contender against whichever semi moderate, business oriented might still be left in the GOP.
The party may well splinter entirely as the moderates flee to the Libertarians which would give us a temporary four way split of extreme left, extreme right, and two moderates at the center. How this will shake out for 2020 could make Congress very very interesting for the next four years as all concerned jockey for position.
Well done Corey. Great creation.
I wonder how soon we will see ads from the debate…
od, probably as soon as they can cobble together a split screen of pence on one side saying drumpf didn’t say what drumpf on the other side is actually saying. maybe with the tagline “now who is lying, who is untrustworthy”
patd…I think you are correct…
Well I didn’t watch the debate but I did listen to about 20 min of the early part, as I drove around town. From the comments I was at a different debate.
3 dimensional chess? That would be giving credit for savvy that just wasn’t apparent last night.
What I saw was one player playing checkers the other playing chinese checkers all on a back gammon board.
Impressions
Kaine got across the points he was trying to get across. and made Pense duck and dodge Trump questions. I think that was what he wanted to do and he did it.
Pense seemed to be trying to avoid Trump and stuck to the old club for growth talking points and lies. Craig may be right that he is aligning himself up as the club for growth candidate for 2020. Given the current GOP civil war I’m not sure how successful that will be.
Finally, It was a VP debate with boring VP persons. You had to be a real political wonk to watch it.
Jack
wonkette: Lying GOP Liar Brags About How Anti-Tim-Kaine Ad Evokes Willie Horton, Then Denies It, Is Liar
Among Monday’s other political weirdness was a brand-new web ad from the Republican National Committee, condemning Tim Kaine for doing this horrible thing years ago: he served as a defense attorney for several bad criminals, helping them get a fair trial just like the U.S. Constitution requires. Shocking! But they were bad people, so in taking their cases, clearly Kaine had to be in favor of their crimes, right? Worse, he tried to keep murdery people from being put to death, surely a terrible thing for a devout Roman Catholic to do. As pure scary criminals will kill us all propaganda, it does a fairly artful job of reframing Tim Kaine, the Universal Stepdad, as a minion of Satan
patd, I wonder if Kaine was appointed as their counsel.
Kaine taught at U of Richmond for 6 years – wonder if it was while I was there? Regardless, he wasn’t one of my profs.
538.com alert – Hillary’s numbers continue to rise. Now they range from 71.8% (Polls plus) to 82% (Now cast). They were 4.2% apart on Sept. 20; they are 53.7% apart now. (Read OH, VA, NC & FL here) At RCP her average is inching up – she’s at 44.1% – trump is at about 40.7.
I dont watch debates, but wait and read the who, whats, and wheres of it the next day.
……will just repeat what ive been saying since the rump was chosen to lead the Rs into the white house……the Ds definetly recieved the gift that keeps on giving….there was so much material to use from last night against him……concentrate on getting the senate and the house back is all i can say…….the rest has been decided imo……
Blue, please come back to the light side of the world….but if you are going to vote for trump….then youve picked some good company in PING…he was just a closet racist before…..he has learned to tone it down….but his hate of people is what keeps him from considering anyone else but his evil haters of anyone else but them thinking….sorta like religion to me no…..only my church is the real one….join or i will blow up the world…..
Ping, im 67 years old…and have seen, been a victim of racial bs since i was in grammar school with the nuns….making me believe that i was just a nobody….the 68 riots were not all that much fun……but i would rather have that in front of me….than the stealth racial bomber that you are…..i always knew that you were…but hid it pretty well until you let it all out…just needed a leader like Trump to bring out the best in you….now you are back to ….stealth bombing……too late your out of the closet……
And about people like me needing a helping hand once in a while…..it was you and your Republican pals that made me go on food stamps for 2 1/2 months…..after the 20008 Bush’s theft of my 401K my house, my construction company that i had for 30 years, hiring people, building affordable homes for them…..helping anyone that asked for it….you and your kind made me go and beg for food…….people talk about heaven and hell…….heaven is full of your kind….stay outta my hell……..
solar, serenity now, serenity now. breathe in breathe out.
WaPo fact checked the VP debate. Pense’s lies were whoppers. Imagine.
Alexandra petri: The vice-presidential debate 2016, or the battle of the dads, recapped
Pat, thanks….not even a little out of serenity ……just had to say it after reading what he wrote when i came back on, he has always hinted at it…… More than once, i have told some abusive parent that was beating his/her kids in line to pay for gas or at some other place…..to stop abusing their own child….im not mad at the time…but i cant ignore it……Sorry if this is not up to the trails behaviour …and will put myself out in the wilderness…later
…….have read here on the trial where some others have told people that if they vote for trump….that they are racist, and Nazis……..I agree….
Ping, is even your own irony lost on you now? Wonder how the Times might get those 5 prior year returns you’d like them to report? Oh, wait, i know the answer to this -Trump would have to release them since he hasn’t. Are you a paid shill for the “who believes this shit” campaign or are you lying for them for free?
Gimme a fricking break.
solar, my recession brother….I was lucky, I kept my house and traded it for cancer and a pile of medical bills, BUT the good news? Mr. Wino is still kicking…we are richer than the vapid trumps. We have more soul, more hokey-pokey left in us for another twenty years! Here is to a rich life under Clinton…trump pays no taxes.
Pogo, patd…thanks for links…
as for Mr. Ping, childhood friend of craig? I think he is having fun at mocking us with his faux news pillow…he once made a reference of the ladies on the trail for having their periods, ‘must be that time of the month’ — way before trump’s period shaming. I had a good time laughing at him…I am in menopause and I doubt I have much circadium rhythm left…just a few beats to share with my female trailmates. The joke is on him. He obviously does not understand ladies…and this country may be ladies night for the next four years.
bid…I rarely push my religion, but join me in following the sun, move yourself to the sunny side of the street…living under a dark, dank bridge? It is showing a dark side without any sunlight. Back to basking for me…
Blondy gal…….I enjoy the combination of humour and just the right touch of pissed off attitude that you have when it come to talking about it all…….Me thinks that is why you are so strongly with Hillary…yes she is Women…and you will roar..but, but you are not going to let some jerk like trump and what he stands for into the white house it you can help it..neither will eye………without getting some old republican friend too riled up at me….i do defend Hillary in every short statements…and without any attitude/talking down to them sorta speak…..
just like you….ive also managed to pick myself up and put one foots in front of the other……I dont know…..but i think that I have just come upon a new passion….almost like that of doing contractor work….just in thinking/planning stages…..am trying to convince myself that im not to old for it……..once again…i do enjoy your combination of getting all out of your system……cept the two party system stuff…….maybe after this election…we just might get another one……..then the real fun will begin….
“….and this country may be ladies night for the next four years.”
bw, fear of that has caused a few to spout nonsense they otherwise would not. not fun being 2nd class citizens, is it fellows?
keep writing, solar…there is a passion.
pogo…the chertoff nod was odd, but he is looking for more gov contracts…he thinks Clinton is going to win.
BID and PING get their talking points from the same place and they faithfully repeat them word for word
I am guessing that trump will not take any debate lessons as he has done numerous town halls with hannity…if anything? He will seethe that pence outdid him. At least I hope for that…the last prez debate was too fun. An off-kilter trump is so entertaining..he does get my vote for entertainer-in-chief buffoon.
So, off the subject, but you know I was pissed when they took my Hillary sign. I have a Hillary sticker on my car and my tire was slashed this morning. Hillary is right, they are a basket of deplorables. No one else in the neighborhood had their tire slashed, but of course they don’t have a Hillary sticker on their car!
“No one else in the neighborhood had their tire slashed, but of course they don’t have a Hillary sticker on their car!”
mamaknows, scary times. the hounds of war have been unleashed.
I hate to say it, but I think I have to remove the sticker, can’t afford to have to replace tires. But, I will still wear my hat, much nicer looking than the Trump hat. I usually wear it when walking my large German Shepherd, so I am okay there.
Hillary Clinton @VoteHillary2016 43m43 minutes ago
In @Mike_Pence‘s defense, we wouldn’t want to defend @realDonaldTrump, either. #VPDebate
Fox News(sic) election map has no relationship to reality no wonder their viewers are delusional
Pat, for you,b/c you post so many that make me laugh….and for Jace, for all the Sublimes…..and for Blondy….caus….she believes in outer space and science stuff….if your having troubles with your serenity…..this will help…and so will the breathing….but in and out of the nose only…never with your mouth….too much bad stuff goes in it …….
forgot…..little description: sound of one being with the universe…we are all that sound…..so when you say this mantra…sing it…we are all connecting to one another………the vibrations that you feel….are outta this world…….You are it, she is it, he is it, we are it,…..and that is that….later
Colombian salida (brexit) vote for peace defeated…no plan B. Voters are flaky this year and the polls for both Britain and Colombia were off. It is ‘why’ I am not letting my guard down…continue the fight for Hillary.
Mama…make a police report. Sorry to hear about the violence…thank goodness it is against inanimate objects…not you.
Thx, solar.
Bernie is stumping across MN today. Thanks to midge mcconnell for clearing the Senate schedule so Bernie could fly in.
One can only hope
I am you as you are he and he is me and we are all together…….
i hear………a mustang……….a mustang Sally……..ride, Sally, ride.
i rode out the recession by hard scramble, eating many hot dogs, and selling everything i had managed to accumulate in life of almost any value at all and some very nice musical instruments…..I had no use for republicans any time before that but now they need to just sit down and shut up for awhile……like maybe the next 8 yrs.
Jezeus, Solar, that was a hair-raising turn of events. And your story is multiplied by millions of others.
It’s all those hot dogs under the bridge which are the real burr under my saddle…..
6-7 yrs of daily agony and buying $7 worth of gas when you need 20 at least.
Pah!
Sun is god
Fire is son of god.
Sturg, yep if you listen close enough…..the mustang is always making us do the sally together……
Am going to tell you and Jack my idea of what i think might help us in what we are doing….You and I for getting out of the hole that they put us in….not so deep anymore….but still a hole…..Jack cus it might be a way to help out his hood….and like a 501c3….train some kids with his abilities..and organizational skills…..
While re-building (without experience, and learned) my motor home….and talking to a lot or people that lost a lot of money during the 2008 financial mess…….and others …..ive come to think that there is a big market out there for re-built motor home….but not as big as mine………think about ….you buy some large diesel stinger van….that gets 28 miles to the gallon….buy it cheap…..then work on the top half of the engine, so some body work, paint it…and install the insulations….the stove…..etc, etc…. and dont forget the cabinets…plenty of them……and sell it cheap enough so it moves out fast…..What a legacy to leave behind…my family s kids and their kid……other people……riding on the Solar-Home………….yes it will have me riding the tops of them all…..solar panels……..for around 15-20k….now even the poor can dream of getting out and enjoying mother earth……going to sell mine…and go get a smaller one….build it….sell it and get two more….or maybe go and see some investor…….
The Solar-Home……..as it is written, so let it be.
Xr, thanks…and yes, I had a friend…as ive said before….kill him self……me im not going anywhere without a little ranting and raving…..so i truly believe that the two party system is what got us to that point…….the ratchet system is what it is…….ratch and hold ratch and hold…….while we are in the middle (class) are in the teeth of the ratchet…..ok….since ive been back…..been talking too much…….later
If you want more political parties, then the local, state and federal laws regarding $$$ and ballot access need to be changed. All of the political parties who are not Dems or Goopers in the US should band together and fight for the necessary change until this happens or George Clooney runs as a Natural Law candidate not much is going to change
Kath…….i understand….and so does Purple…i think that is why he is not around now….maybe waiting until the election is over………he, like myself believe that until we do something about how we elect our politicians ….we wont get anywhere …so we are stuck…..nothing is going change ….unless we get financial reform…..im waiting to see how much money is going to be involved watching this comedy/disaster show that we are in now……..i keep thingking…..this cant be real?????….but it is……how did we get here….if not the two party system……they control it all…….we really dont have a voice you know…..just going to the game to watch which of the t eams wine this time……
Remember, only the lions (big biz, big politicians) win at the Colosseum….
Pence and Trump
Too bad for Ping & pence’s econ theories. The ever-expanding national debt should shove gold prices up, according to conservatives. However, since 9:15 AM gold has lost $200/lb.
Dear Old Drumpf has made a change from he will release his taxes when “the audit is finished” to he will release when “they are finished”.
This could have just been a slip of the lip but it only started after more and more people started demanding to see the IRS letter announcing the audit.
Take you pick. He was never under audit and he was lying.
He was audited but now has to make corrections, pay a fine, and refile because he was lying.
Three he actually filed for an extension, has paid estimated taxes (in his case maybe zero) and now finally has to file, so saying they were being audited was a lie.
XR, I’m guessing that’s $200/oz? When the market starts to contract gold will go back up.
Alexandra Petri knocks it out of the park with her recap of the VP debate.
solar, thanks. that beautiful chant in the background makes reading the news a bit more palatable. not so likely to kick in the screen with its soothing connectivity to what is really real.
od, here’s a new ad using the debate comments
and here’s daily show recap
Buenos, Solar, et al. Retro rv’s are all the rage these days. Small compact one axle rv’s from the 50’s and 60’s are popular with weekend campers. The motor home market is for boomers who can afford six figure rigs. They stay at big resorts at $70 plus a night specially built for motor homes. Owners are often full-timers, while the travel trailer crowd, like us, go out for three or four weeks at a time, once or twice a year. 28 mpg? Wow! That’s awesome! My diesel f250 only gets 15 without a trailer and 10 pulling our 36 foot travel trailer. Talking with other rvers, my rig seems to be about normal. Good luck with your rv projects.
eprof & solar, how’s this…. real down homey
Pogo, no, gold dropped $200/lb in 3 hours. That’s about $20/troy oz. For gold, the drop in value was pretty damn quick. About 1.6%
Shrimp boats gonna rock and roll this weekend.
ah ha! miss marples of who-dun-it fame! oh sorry, must be a misspell.
nymag:
But there’s another theory that’s more plausible and arguably even juicier: Marla Maples, Trump’s ex-wife, is the Times’ anonymous source. In a post on Medium, Yashar Ali gathered some of the clues. First and foremost, there is a “Sign-Here” flag on the first page of the New Jersey nonresident tax return, and it points to the spot for Maples’s signature.
[….]
Maples also addressed one of the biggest clues that she might be the leaker: Back in 1999, when Trump was reportedly mulling a presidential run, she told the London Telegraph, “If he is really serious about being president and runs in the general election next year, I will not be silent … I will feel it is my duty as an American citizen to tell the people what he is really like.”
When asked about the remark, Maples said she didn’t recall saying it and, according to Nuzzi, “suggested the quote had been fabricated.” She wouldn’t say whether she’d signed a nondisclosure agreement, as is common in Trump’s inner circle. As BuzzFeed previously reported, in response to the Telegraph quote, Trump complained that Maples had violated her “confidentiality agreement,” attacked her in the press, and withheld her alimony payment, prompting a legal battle.
While a lawyer for Trump threatened the Times with “prompt initiation of appropriate legal action” if it published the tax returns, it would actually be perfectly legal for Maples to release her own tax information. According to Yashar Ali, she wouldn’t even be violating the confidentiality agreement, if it exists. “I spoke to two lawyers that specialize in family law and both told me that they have never seen a restriction around tax returns in a prenup or settlement agreement,” he writes.
hmmmm. no wonder pence held his tongue. he must have [as the above link says re maples] signed a nondisclosure agreement, as is common in Trump’s inner circle.
the plot thickens… there’s mystery and mayhem afoot
npr: ‘The Atlantic’ Endorses Hillary Clinton For President
Avaunt!
XR, ok – just never heard of anyone reporting gold prices by pound. But yes, that’s a quick drop for a “stable” investment. I always see ounce, gram and kilogram. Learn sumpin’ new every day I guess.
Precious metals – I’ve got a friend who back in the 80s invested in silver, you know, just in case. He bought when it was trading in the $30s. When I worked with him in the early 90s his investment was worth about 1/5 what he had invested. Precious metals can be a good investment, if you buy when they are cheap. Then on the other hand….
From 2011 until now gold has lost about 1/3 of its value. And Rush and Glenn have been telling me what a great investment it is. I have my doubts.
Pat, That looks like a real good fit for the Whiskey Jack…a pick-em-up-home…..
El Prof…..glad to see you again…..thanks for the info…yes they can go very high.. I had a cpl of Doge Sprinter vans that were large size…with a desil engine….they were weighed down pretty good with welding machine and other work equipment….they held up pretty well and did get about 22 per gal if kept up…tune-ups, oil changes etc……they did tend to go rusty a lot tho…..did a lot priming and spray painting……
Ive been to state parks mostly…they average around 22 dollars per night…..there is a new one right here by me in cook county il….that has a great lake, fishing, boating, biking and more…..i love the fast, steep trails on it…….
oops, wrong pic….the correct one wont load………….just read that VP Gore is going to stump for Hillary. He will take her all he way……even if it means going thru the Supreme Court………
Not sure SCOTUS is the best path Hillary could take if it’s with Gore. His history there leaves something to be desired.
I think Gore is there to remind people every vote counts and people should think long and hard before voting for Gary Johnson or Jill Stein
Great article for both history and movie buffs:
How Hollywood Whitewashed the Old West
GOP Senator Johnny Isaakson:
Congress less likely to stonewall Hillary Clinton
The cover upcoming issue of The Nation. The artist goes by @ZenPopArt on Twitter, but I don’t know his/her real name
Patd, nice rig! Solar, the Dodge with a Cummings engine will get fairly good mpg if you can stand the racket and noise. We can tell when our friend with a 70’s Dodge pick-up is coming over as we can hear him two blocks away. Lol!
Anybody got a thread post urging to get out for tomorrow?
Tony, Flatus, and Sturg…. Please take care and get to high ground. I will be thinking of you tomorrow.
Pence was mansplaining things to all of America nd he looked good doing it the problem of course was that almost nothing he said was true.
Trump is dropping like a rock…Nate Silver has Hillary’s chances ar 76.2%…Trump could soon be in the teens.
The Donald needs to lose big to save the GOP from itself…
Safe wishes for everyone in storm areas!!!
New York Times Upshot has Trump with 19% chance of winning…
When the deadbeat loses, there will be as many causes put forward as there are grains of sand in the South Seas. None of them will deal with what really ails the republican party.
What ails the ripper party most is their addiction to lies.
How do you get 28% of the country to admit their addiction and check into Hazelden ? You can’t. Therefore, the die by self-medicating on the intellectual equivalent of LSD laced candy floss.
The fact that the rippers only represent the 1% doesn’t help either.
Not trying to pull a Godwin here, but precisely the same problem was faced by the Germans in WWII. As a German victory would only benefit the upper scum of the nazi party, the rest of the planet had no incentive to co-operate.
Solar
Great post and yes you really have been through it over the years.. Always with a good attitude. Glad you’re not wasting any time.. Doing things you want to do.. Good post to BW, i laugh at both of your comments, brings me joy..
Renee
I’m hoping for the best as it looks like CAT 4 still.. Spent the day working and removing deck furniture from some of my Orlando client’s beach places, ugh, beautiful day too.. I got my pool area dismantled and tomorrow shutters.. Not looking looking forward to power outage and no AC.. Ah, that’s the least of it, hopefully minimal damage and loss of life..
Mama,
I’m so sorry to hear about your tire and some people’s cruelty. Take the sticker off.. You can’t worry every second about more damage. So terrible when they rain on our parades, why why why… Hillary winning will be a nice thing..
tweet and story reported by cnn:
Michael Reagan @ReaganWorld
My father would not support this kind of campaign,if this is what the Republican Party wants leave us Reagans out.Nancy would vote for HRC https://twitter.com/mjclaxden/status/782813480780914688 …
1:30 AM – 3 Oct 2016 · Los Angeles, CA, United States
For months people have been asking for the IRS letter announcing an audit. Our so called News Outlets are finally starting to catch up.
Is Donald Trump Actually Under Audit
Holy Matthew…storm surge of biblical proportions. Stay safe on the trail my coastal mixers. I contacted my cousin who lives in the W. Palm Beach area…I am concerned about my 94 year old aunt. In 2004, when hurricane Frances hit Ft. Pierce where my Mom was in assisted living? We had already started making arrangements to get her out of Florida and to New Mexico. My sister from Pennsylvania was tasked with getting her packed and on the plane. The hurricane hit the day before the she arrived…her hotel reservation was lost to the utility workers…the parking lot filled with trucks. My sister paid to stay with my Mom and was given 1 gallon of water. She did get Mom on the plane and none of us has ever returned to Florida…my parents retirement dream had ended and their beloved home, community, way of life was gone. The night of the hurricane? The residents of the assisted living facility were sitting in a hallway all night…dementia patients, patients in wheelchairs…how scary for them. Please stay safe my friends. And a shout-out to the utility workers…the humans who put it back together. Florida is so flat…so many sinkholes…just the ocean taking over.
Good to see dems coalesce around Clinton…repugs are doing the same with pence…another man of the 1950s like trump. As a time traveler? I prefer the 1970s — best music ever. I never want to see the reagan years again — the hairstyles! As the last of baby boomers die-out? We will see more of the digital future…the old analog flow gone. The power is fading…clash of the very tired baby boomers continues. The transition moves forward and you know how I feel about transition…change is wonderful, it is the transition that kills.
NEW THREAD. Thanks, Pat