Having skipped the show, except for a few seconds until I changed the radio station in the bedroom, I slept well. From the few things I have read/skimmed this morning I suppose I should be looking for a new presidential candidate. Panic time? Coffin shopping for the old guy? Biden lost somewhere in the park feeding pigeons?
Almost nothing about sfb, other than he was strong, leading, on his feet. Nothing about his brain not being in the same room as Joe. I am sure a drug test on him would be as clean as mine, or would be if he was not full of stuff.
Something I read a few days ago about the future “debate” came true. It was that cramming for a test may result in not doing well. Over prepared and hesitating on putting down which response is best. A couple of the columns were more about the optics than anything else. Biden was the best and sane. Too bad he was not pumped full of those mystery performance enhancing drugs for one night.
BB, yeah many a folk are wringing their hands this morn. it wasn’t that long ago same thing happened to obama on his debate with mitt but he eventually won the race. here’s a ditty we’ll hear from all those crying in their beer today:
The truth needed a standard-bearer in Atlanta, and President Biden wasn’t up to the job.
“Do more—worry less.”
—Gavin Newsom
big big question to be answered toot sweet
at 9:44 and 9:47 last night Bink wrote:
holy fuck trump just admitted on international tv that Putin told him he was going to invade Ukraine in advance.
when did he talk to putin about ukraine why was he talking to putin about ukraine what did they tell each other about ukraine before trump tried to extort ukraine
not only NOT coming to ukraine’s defense per the 1994 budapest memorandum looks like he didn’t even alert ukraine about the planned invasion. so now shouldn’t he be held accountable for all those thousands of dead ukrainians in addition to the 200,000 usa covid deaths he caused?
All the apologists are out in force. It might be more effective if Biden made an appearance.
Good morning. I slept fine. Thanks for getting up early, Pat, and starting our thread.
My take is a traitorous liar should not be on stage. Notwithstanding, no one was on-duty last night to catch and stop the lies. Everyone there was spellbound by the sight of a crazed inmate ranting inside his cell, banging on the bars, and powerless to stop it.
The flaw is in the format. Joe should not have to expend his limited talk-time refuting a tsunami of lies. A proven liar and convicted felon does not belong on the podium.
Our system of checks and balances has failed. Thanks, Mitch.
big big question to be answered toot sweet
Indeed, Pat. Bink is onto something. Not only the Felon’s ongoing treason, but Mitch’s abdication of duty times two.
Woke up very sad this morning. Stopping Trump suddenly seems much more difficult. Joe Biden is a good man and a successful president, but he’s not up to this, maybe he never was. Perhaps Trump is odious enough to swing voters that it doesn’t matter, but it’s a much bigger gamble now.
Biden at Atlanta Waffle House;
”It’s hard to debates a liar. “
The Bidens went to a Waffle House, and even after the debate when POTUS Joe was leaving and talking to who I assume were the technicians in the studio, his voice was stronger and he sounded more like himself.
Orange Adolf always sounds the same because he always lies, always fear mongers, always whines.
You’re a loser, Donald. You always have been and you always will be. There is no hope for you.
Yes, with republicans and weak democrats hammering on the “drop out Joe” drum it’s become suddenly much harder to defeat stump. Endless cycle of wash, rinse, repeat. The question glares out like a floodlight; If Biden were to drop out WHAT would be the winning solution? It may be the old rock and a hard place but When has it NOT been for democrats? With Biden, it’s maybe close—without Biden, say hello to Fascism.
Stump gave his regular week in-week out pack of lies, which neither fooled, nor swayed ANYONE. One debate and the proven Winner should bow down to the fascist Loser? Nuh uh. Listen to Gavin Newsom, a man who knows the score.
I will say that President Biden needs to use whatever throat spray or nebulizer professional singers use, and maybe find someone who teaches Alexander Technique to strengthen his voice.
The orange, convicted felon who is a deranged sociopath had his meds administered at the proper time and dosage, but that didn’t keep him from lying; it just made him lie more clearly.
Didn’t Obama have a terrible first debate once upon a time?
He’s not “about to die”, he just did poorly in a non-fact checked debate against a fire hose of lies.
Biden blew it last night. Hard to say, but he did. So now he has a summer of campaigning and meeting with world leaders to do to rehab his image. I think he will do so. (BB, that was me that commented on his debate cramming – it didn’t work. Seemed instead to have caused confusion)
Both President Joe Biden and former President Donald Trump made false and misleading claims during CNN’s presidential debate on Thursday – but Trump did so far more than Biden, just like in their debates in 2020.
Trump made more than 30 false claims at the Thursday debate. They included numerous claims that CNN and others have already debunked during the current presidential campaign or prior.
Trump’s repeat falsehoods included his assertions that some Democratic-led states allow babies to be executed after birth, that every legal scholar and everybody in general wanted Roe v. Wade overturned, that there were no terror attacks during his presidency, that Iran didn’t fund terror groups during his presidency, that the US has provided more aid to Ukraine than Europe has, that Biden for years referred to Black people as “super predators,” that Biden is planning to quadruple people’s taxes, that then-House Speaker Nancy Pelosi turned down 10,000 National Guard troops for the US Capitol on January 6, 2021, that Americans don’t pay the cost of his tariffs on China and other countries, that Europe accepts no American cars, that he is the president who got the Veterans Choice program through Congress, and that fraud marred the results of the 2020 election.
Trump also added some new false claims, such as his assertions that the US currently has its biggest budget deficit and its biggest trade deficit with China. Both records actually occurred under Trump.
Biden made at least nine false or misleading claims in the debate. He used false numbers while describing two of his key Medicare policies, falsely claimed that no US troops had been killed on his watch, repeated his usual misleading figure about billionaires’ tax rates, baselessly claimed that Trump wants to eliminate Social Security, falsely said that the unemployment rate was 15% when he took office, inaccurately said that the Border Patrol union had endorsed him before clarifying that he was talking about agents’ support for the border bill he had backed, and exaggerated Trump’s 2020 comments about the possibility of treating Covid-19 by injecting disinfectant.
Here is a detailed fact check from CNN’s reporting team.
[Continues]
The video attached to that linked CNN fact check is priceless.
Personally, I don’t want to hear another drop of Drop-Out-Joe-ism without a SOLUTION to winning this election to follow it. No winning solution? Go wait in the truck.
We must focus not just on the fact that he lied, but the existential danger in those lies.
Somewhere I read last night a reminder that it was decided that Hillary won all 3 debates vs trump… didn’t matter.
It is summertime… the real work will begin in Sept. as Jack has reminded us.
To put it in perspective I think of being on an airplane. The flight attendant comes down the aisle with her food cart and, eventually; parks it beside my seat. “Can I interest you in the chicken?” she asks. “Or would you prefer the platter of shit with bits of broken glass in it?
To be undecided in this election is to pause for a moment and then ask how the chicken is cooked.
—David Sedatis
The media drumbeat about “the undecided” is a just a total crock.
today’s meme…
Oh, and AP debunks Dumbass’ suggestion that he offered and Pelosi refused 10,000 NG troops on 1/6.
CLAIM: House Speaker Nancy Pelosi blocked the National Guard from coming to the Capitol during the Jan. 6 insurrection.
AP’S ASSESSMENT: False. As Speaker of the House, Pelosi does not direct the National Guard. Further, as the Capitol came under attack, she and the Senate Majority leader called for military assistance, including the National Guard.
THE FACTS: On Tuesday, a false claim about the deadly Jan. 6 riot at the Capitol resurfaced suggesting that Pelosi blocked the National Guard from coming to lawmakers’ defense during the insurrection at the Capitol.
“@SpeakerPelosi, why did you block the National Guard from protecting the Capitol?” Indiana Rep. Jim Banks tweeted.
Minority Leader Kevin McCarthy posed a similar question on Fox News saying, “Was there a decision by the Speaker not to have the National Guard at the Capitol that day?”
The answer is no.
“On January 6th, the Speaker, a target of an assassination attempt that day, was no more in charge of Capitol security than Mitch McConnell was. This is a clear attempt to whitewash what happened on January 6th and divert blame,” Drew Hammill, a spokesperson for Pelosi told The Associated Press in an email.
The decision on whether to call National Guard troops to the Capitol is made by what is known as the Capitol Police Board, which is made up of the House Sergeant at Arms, the Senate Sergeant at Arms and the Architect of the Capitol. The board decided not to call the guard ahead of the insurrection but did eventually request assistance after the rioting had already begun, and the troops arrived several hours later.
The House Sergeant at Arms reports to Pelosi and the Senate Sergeant at Arms reported to McConnell, a Republican who was then Senate Majority Leader. There is no evidence that either directed the security officials not to call the guard beforehand, and Hammill said after the insurrection that Pelosi was never informed of such a request.
[Continues]
Imagine SFB lying. I’m shocked.
Larry Sabato makes a good point: “Now he has to do a lot of unscripted appearances and interviews to show last night was abnormal. If he doesn’t we can assume it was normal for him.”
“Alarmed by Biden’s debate showing, some senior Democrats look to Schumer, Jeffries and Jill Biden to urge the president to rethink his campaign.”
When faced with a lying fascist who has already lost to the Democrat once….why do democrats ALWAYS want to go on the attack……to attack the Democrat?
”Politico” is a great source now? What’s wrong with pointing out that Politico is full of shit?
it was worst-case scenario bad, sturge
we don’t need another bader-ginsburg situation, in the moment we were saying some cute “RBG” puns, now we’re losing every case SCotUS takes
It’s so easy to find people who want to point at all the flaws and problems. Those people are easy to find. They make parades of them to go on tv just to point out flaws and problems. JUST ONCE…..I’d for them to speak to a solution. Just one little bitty solution. No…..it’s just so comfy to sit in the arm chair pointing out problems. we’re faced with a lying fascist turd.
Quick! Attack the Democrat!
Ok…..who’s the replacement?
Newsom? So we get a nonstop barrage about California and Pelosi? Harris? So we get what they will level at her? Hillary?
If not Biden, who?
I’d like a clue to the identity of this champion, waiting in the wings to spring fully armed from th head of Zeus.
Newsome
Michelle but she won’t do it
Hm… who else can win the most important national election ever on short notice hmmmmmmmmmmmm
The GOP should also replace their candidate with one that’s not a compulsively-lying criminal traitor, also
i believe in accentuating the positive but not while my house is on fire
i mean at least it’s Friday, how’s that? 🤷♂️ ✌️ 🇺🇸
Biden does need to get out and about unless he can’t. One thing that bothers me at present is that he seems to be displaying symptoms of ischemia which can be transient until it’s not.
Well it all merely re-enforces my little pet theory that human DNA contains the seeds of Civil War in any group, large or small and humans will never overcome the need. (Even had one on the Trailmix)
Remember kennedy and Jimmy Carter? Bush v Gore? How the democrats let themselves be ripped asunder by internecine strife ? How nice to see it rear its yoogly head again.
Well, no immunity decision today, but decisions that keep homeless people from camping in certain areas; the Chevron decision that said courts have to defer to agencies for interpretation of vague statutes, rather than rely on the expertise of the agencies to decide whether the agency is complying; limited the scope of obstruction of official proceedings by a narrow reading that could cause the dismissal of some of the 1/6 cases and one other case. Next cases (last of the term) will be Monday.
Yes, out and about is where Joe needs to be, with broad coverage of that by the campaign.
Newsome’s time will come unless I miss my guess, but I don’t see the party changing horses in mid stream. If I had to place a bet I’d bet he will be the nominee in 2028.
Not advocating this but I can imagine a scenario where 6 weeks of campaigning to an open convention in mid-august could be an invigorating prospect for Democrats, showcasing what a deep bench they actually have and sucking the oxygen out of the Trump campaign.
I live in SC. I know all about stupid people.
The only way the Fascist wins is if he can split the democrats. His only hope.
Say these undecideds and whatnot have 7 to 8 weeks of democrats chewing on one another. Taking sides against the likes of Newsom, Harris, and Clyburn.
Or what if Joe drops out at a perfect time and the ticket of Harris—Newsom proceeds.
Darn…..2 Californians.
Sturg, I agree that is not what Dems want, or at least we shouldn’t, but Andrea the Breathless is hard at work “questioning” how Joe can survive last night and who should replace him. I’m not sure how a bad night at the podium should have a bigger effect on Joe’s campaign than a 34 count guilty verdict and sentencing should have on Dumbass’, unless voters really don’t give a shit about having a felon as president.
I don’t get it. Biden is fired up and ready to go in Raleigh rally right now. Completely different person than last night.
Cannon is beginning to show her true colors. And we thought the delays were the gambit. Au contraire, Pierre. WaPo.
U.S. District Judge Aileen M. Cannon said Thursday that she will hold a hearing for Donald Trump’s lawyers to challenge some of the evidence gathered against him for alleged mishandling of classified documents and obstructing government efforts to retrieve them.
In an 11-page order, the judge said that “further factual development is warranted” when it comes to Trump’s challenge to the search warrant for Mar-a-Lago — his Florida home and private club. FBI agents searched his home on Aug. 8, 2022, finding 103 classified documents that eventually led to his indictment.
The former president, who is the presumptive Republican challenger to President Biden in the November election,is seeking to suppress much of that evidence by arguing that the search warrant was faulty.
As part of her ruling, Cannon also said Trump’s defense lawyers were entitled to a hearing on whether prosecutors had misused statements by one of Trump’s former lawyers.
Cannon said she would shortly issue a separate order on when she will hear those issues in court.
[…]
He may not need to pardon himself after all if she keeps going down this road.
Great Raleigh speech that now needs to be repeated as close to daily as possible!
he was stuttering a bit which likely means auditory processing issues i’d guess because of studio/mic setup
putting an 83 year old on a 60sec timer ain’t ideal either
this too…
the good news for me is that i can start using “Jake Tapper” in punchlines again cuz he made a joke of his career last night
ok forcing myself to shut up, pardon
Where was this guy last night? Biden: “I don’t walk as easy as I used to. I don’t speak as smoothly as I used to… I know how to tell the truth. I know right from wrong. I know how to do this job…I know like millions of Americans know; when you get knocked down you get back up!”
“Remember kennedy and Jimmy Carter? Bush v Gore? How the democrats let themselves be ripped asunder by internecine strife ? “
sturge, yep it’s the DNA, Democratic Naysaying Assholes, every time we’ve lost…. i’m still upset about what happened to hubert humphrey, to say nothing of how they trashed hillary…. thanks to the DNA we’ve had to endure nixon, reagan, bush and the rump.
change horses in a midstream full of sharks, gators and piranha??? no way, not even if the old horse is a bit lame, odds are he can still get you out of there.
putting an 83 year old on a 60sec timer ain’t ideal either
Exactly, Bink. It was not Joe’s element, not this time. His people should’ve known that. Perfect out for them would’ve been refusing to share an equal stage with a convicted criminal.
Joe was great in Raleigh this afternoon, using a teleprompter. I feel like I did years ago when I was drinking and did or said something hurtful, stupid, or dangerous. I mean I wish we could get a do-over and delete last night. I almost got physically sick during that debacle. But Joe got back on the horse and rode straight and upright today. Long may Joe run. Steve Bannon is reporting to prison on Monday. Maybe Trump can be his bunkie when sentencing day happens, very soon.
Biden’s TikTok influencers are out in force. Here’s a good one..
“He didn’t judge a man by how many times he got knocked down but by how fast he got back up. Get up! That was his phrase, and it has echoed through my life…Get up!”
-Joe Biden, Promises to Keep, Prologue, writing of his father’s influence
Why do I feel like the String Quartet on the Titanic?
Patd……Yes…….Pres Nixon, Reagan, Bush2, and Bump.
If the shit hits the fan, how does Josh Shapiro/ Gretchen Whitmer sound? As to the Whitmer/Buttigieg problem of dual Michigan residency, hell, easy. One of them move like Cheney did with W.
Watch Shapiro sometime. He’s very presidential.
Panic, panic, panic. Lets nominate Bernie. After all he is the reason we have Biden rather than someone younger. Clyburn panicked and got us in this mess. Face it Biden has always been a shitty campaigner and a fck up in key moments. Situation normal.
Biden is just lucky it is the week before Independence day and not the week before labor day.
Jack
Nancy Pelosi on Trump’s ridiculous claim she’s responsible for J6: “He’s a fool. He thinks I planned my own assassination? He’s sicker than I thought.”
How about a Trump / Clinton rematch? She could offer to be one term while the party develops all the under card of potentials.
Gee, why would Nancy Pelosi be attacking the Fascist instead of Joe Biden?
Mel Brooks is 98 years old today. That is a lot of laughter.
You don’t hear Republicans trying to ditch their felon.
Blue
It’s a Democratic trait. The left attacks the moderate to conservative branches and vice versa as much as the @GOP. They often even use the same arguments.
For the love of might, Dems need to start making more noise about Project 2025, which goes beyond tRUMPsky-ism.
politics is theater and Biden flopped hard, let us all down, **** cheerleading, there are lives at stake
low-info voters being fed the absolute worst headlines ever and it’s not the fault of rank-and-file Democrats, it’s Team Biden’s fault, full stop
I just detest Our Revolution for trodding on Biden. Republicans never do this; they circle the wagons. Look what happened to Al Franken.
Orange Adolf lied, fear mongered, and trash talked. No policy. No positivity. He’s lowlife scum.
Like attracts like.
Turds of a feather.
Yada, yada, yada.
Breaking News: Steve Bannon will have to go to prison Monday after the Supreme Court rejected his final effort to stave off a four-month sentence for contempt of Congress. nyti.ms/3znLEE0
Olbermann
…to one obvious question: “Is it too late to replace Biden?” There are three answers, the most important of which is: if you do, you trade a still likely victory over evil for certain defeat. No would-be replacement comes within 10 points of Trump in polling. It’s that simple.
“The “Chevron deference” has long been the backbone of how corporations are regulated. The new ruling strips federal agencies of their power to determine what’s best for Americans.”
“On Friday, June 28, the court ruled 6-3 in favor of overturning the “Chevron deference,” a backbone principle for how the federal government keeps corporations in check. Chevron is the practice by which federal courts defer to federal agencies when sorting out ambiguities in a law.”
Without the Chevron deference, experts warn that judges — and not federal agencies themselves — could determine certain environmental regulations.
“If you uproot Chevron, what you’re doing is … saying the agency tasked with doing something — let’s say, controlling pollution, or improving K-12 education — they can go ahead and do what they think is best, but if someone doesn’t like what they did, and they bring the agency to court, there’s no assurance the court will side with the agency,” says Moffa.
Effing chaos monsters! They don’t need no stinkin’ regulations.
New York Times editorial board, voters “cannot be expected to ignore what was instead plain to see: Mr. Biden is not the man he was four years ago.”
“If the race comes down to a choice between Mr. Trump and Mr. Biden, the sitting president would be this board’s unequivocal pick. That is how much of a danger Mr. Trump poses. But given that very danger, the stakes for the country and the uneven abilities of Mr. Biden, the United States needs a stronger opponent to the presumptive Republican nominee. To make a call for a new Democratic nominee this late in a campaign is a decision not taken lightly, but it reflects the scale and seriousness of Mr. Trump’s challenge to the values and institutions of this country and the inadequacy of Mr. Biden to confront him.”
NYT has been attempting to bring about Joe’s abdication for a long time.
How does it serve the country if no alternate candidate comes close to Biden’s polling numbers? What of VP Harris? Everyone seems pretty itchy to trash her, too. No! No! No!
Circle the wagons around President Biden AND attack tRUMPsky via Project 2025. Folks seem to be willing to buy his orange BS and overlook his character. They need to know what THEY will lose. They need to understand how the ultra-wealthy will continue to have tax cuts, Social Security will be jeopardized, and nothing will be regulated except women’s bodies.
Seeing today’s clip, I note that Joe also is an extrovert and I wonder if the lack of audience energy affected him adversely. The lighting last night was harsh too, made him look washed out. Today better on both counts.
The lighting was no friend to Orange Man either, he was oily and iridescent. The old pompadour is now a poop-adour.
Hey fairweather Dems…I’m outside of Stonewall where President Biden is raising the roof. Maybe you can borrow some of his 80 yr old fight. #StandByYourMan
I was proud to be a surrogate for team Biden/Harris tonight but was deeply disheartened by the egregious abdication of journalistic responsibility we saw on that debate stage. Donald doesn’t need any favors.
lol now y’all believe the polls
Attack the Right People 101 StillRidinWithBiden24 So the NYT Editorial Board is calling for Biden to drop out? Trump is a convicted felon who organized a terrorist attack on our Capitol and stood on the debate stage and lied all night but they don’t call on HIM to drop out? FOH
Let’s see how veterans and union workers and women feel about the orange fascist v President Biden.
The debate is over. We have video of tRUMPsky lying, trash talking and fear mongering. That will make good ads, too, when compared with the facts.
I don’t place much trust in polls, but I certainly do trust Mr Olbermann’s opinion. Even more so since he appears to agree with me on most things political.
Attack the right people
The folks ready to dump the Prez (and, presumably, the VP) are being met with a backlash they did not imagine. That, coupled with POTUS Joe’s strong showing in the hours since the debate, are proving that he has staying power.
Suggestion: Hammer away on Project 2025 if you really want to be helpful, and back the hell offa Biden!
Urban: Do you wish you didn’t endorse him?
Kinzinger: No. I’m proud of standing against the habitual liar who lies about everything from January 6th to his golf game
Attack the right people
Rachel Bitecofer’s Xttr. I don’t do Xttr, but I can read them when they pop up. I agree with anybody named Rachel, for personal reasons.
I’m assuming we’re gonna see dramatically declined ratings. Obama lost debate 1 too. And just like with this debate, he “lost” because Rs said he lost and Ds are so naively honest, they publicly agreed with them. Rs would never do that no matter how bad Trump was
Trump plane parked at Dulles, right next to Russian Embassy staff plane.
Oh boy….i seem to have learned how to do that.
Sturgeone – that is not the first time such a coincidence has happened. If I remember I will try to do a search later on.
Are we still freaking out over Joe having a rough start of the show? I am not freaking out. It is not the age of him that should be an issue. The overall issue is we are at a point that we do not have a Dem challenger in position to take on sfb or any other white supremacist or white nationalist or koch team or christian fascist movement. And that is to win whatever seat is in contention.
Well, at least one more.
@ltgrusselhonore
#Democrats Please stop Pissing on yourself , it is what it is ! The other guy is a lying convicted felon awaiting another court appearance next week! The #MAGA Republicans went to court with him ! Get your Azz off the ground and circle the wagons, save our democracy help get out the Vote !“ In war you will lose a battle , stay focus, learn, adapt, and overcome focus on winning the war “ Stop beating your guy and focus on the lying criminal
POTUS Joe might just get a delayed bounce out of this! C’mon union and military members. C’mon women. C’mon folks who care about Social Security and Medicare. C’mon anyone who doesn’t want to live in what will feel like muddy Rusher!
Listening to white folks blithely talk about pushing Biden off a cliff, skipping over Harris, and trotting out some white person like ain’t nobody gonna notice that is some *hilarious* shit.
School’s back in session.
It went on and on, and that was the point. This was not a debate. It was Trump using a technique that actually has a formal name, the Gish gallop, although I suspect he comes by it naturally. It’s a rhetorical technique in which someone throws out a fast string of lies, non-sequiturs, and specious arguments, so many that it is impossible to fact-check or rebut them in the amount of time it took to say them. Trying to figure out how to respond makes the opponent look confused, because they don’t know where to start grappling with the flood that has just hit them.
-Professor Heather Cox Richardson
That right there is as well as I’ve heard it put.
One of my favorite Heathers.
The term was coined in 1994 by anthropologist Eugenie Scott, who named it after American creationist Duane Gish and argued that Gish used the technique frequently when challenging the scientific fact of evolution.[1]
“The Biden campaign on Friday touted $14 million raised on debate day and the morning after, noting that it saw its single best hour of fundraising – between 11 p.m. and midnight – since the president announced his run for re-election last April.”
And, unlike Orange Adolf, none of it will go to pay legal fees!
“The ‘Pod Save America’ guide to saving democracy
Post-presidential debate, the hosts of the ‘Pod Save America’ share debate analysis informed by their own White House and political campaign experience. Plus, their guide to saving democracy ahead of the 2024 election.”
i guess i should be listening to “Pod Save America”
There’s a car hood on the ground by my car. Glad I didn’t park any closer. I think it’s just rain for the rest of the night. I’ve never seen so much lightning for such a long period of time.
Hope w’jack is OK
“i feel bad for tigers in zoos. Imagine being in prison your whole life being constantly visited by sandwiches”
-Jacob Samuel
If it was supposedly everybody else’s job to fact check the Felon except the Felon’s, then it is now a given he’s permitted, indeed expected to lie. With impunity.
for real time Trail thoughts during and immediately after see last thread and for some media response see below:
Who Won the Presidential Debate Between Biden and Trump? – The New York Times (nytimes.com)
Biden stumbles in fiery debate as Trump spreads falsehoods – The Washington Post
Biden struggles to land lines as Trump lies in first presidential debate | US elections 2024 | The Guardian
https://www.politico.com/live-updates/2024/06/27/biden-trump-first-presidential-debate/lights-out-00165697
Having skipped the show, except for a few seconds until I changed the radio station in the bedroom, I slept well. From the few things I have read/skimmed this morning I suppose I should be looking for a new presidential candidate. Panic time? Coffin shopping for the old guy? Biden lost somewhere in the park feeding pigeons?
Almost nothing about sfb, other than he was strong, leading, on his feet. Nothing about his brain not being in the same room as Joe. I am sure a drug test on him would be as clean as mine, or would be if he was not full of stuff.
Something I read a few days ago about the future “debate” came true. It was that cramming for a test may result in not doing well. Over prepared and hesitating on putting down which response is best. A couple of the columns were more about the optics than anything else. Biden was the best and sane. Too bad he was not pumped full of those mystery performance enhancing drugs for one night.
BB, yeah many a folk are wringing their hands this morn. it wasn’t that long ago same thing happened to obama on his debate with mitt but he eventually won the race. here’s a ditty we’ll hear from all those crying in their beer today:
Dana Milbank: The Debate’s Biggest Loser: The Truth
“Do more—worry less.”
—Gavin Newsom
big big question to be answered toot sweet
at 9:44 and 9:47 last night Bink wrote:
not only NOT coming to ukraine’s defense per the 1994 budapest memorandum looks like he didn’t even alert ukraine about the planned invasion. so now shouldn’t he be held accountable for all those thousands of dead ukrainians in addition to the 200,000 usa covid deaths he caused?
All the apologists are out in force. It might be more effective if Biden made an appearance.
Good morning. I slept fine. Thanks for getting up early, Pat, and starting our thread.
My take is a traitorous liar should not be on stage. Notwithstanding, no one was on-duty last night to catch and stop the lies. Everyone there was spellbound by the sight of a crazed inmate ranting inside his cell, banging on the bars, and powerless to stop it.
The flaw is in the format. Joe should not have to expend his limited talk-time refuting a tsunami of lies. A proven liar and convicted felon does not belong on the podium.
Our system of checks and balances has failed. Thanks, Mitch.
Indeed, Pat. Bink is onto something. Not only the Felon’s ongoing treason, but Mitch’s abdication of duty times two.
Woke up very sad this morning. Stopping Trump suddenly seems much more difficult. Joe Biden is a good man and a successful president, but he’s not up to this, maybe he never was. Perhaps Trump is odious enough to swing voters that it doesn’t matter, but it’s a much bigger gamble now.
Biden at Atlanta Waffle House;
”It’s hard to debates a liar. “
The Bidens went to a Waffle House, and even after the debate when POTUS Joe was leaving and talking to who I assume were the technicians in the studio, his voice was stronger and he sounded more like himself.
Orange Adolf always sounds the same because he always lies, always fear mongers, always whines.
You’re a loser, Donald. You always have been and you always will be. There is no hope for you.
Yes, with republicans and weak democrats hammering on the “drop out Joe” drum it’s become suddenly much harder to defeat stump. Endless cycle of wash, rinse, repeat. The question glares out like a floodlight; If Biden were to drop out WHAT would be the winning solution? It may be the old rock and a hard place but When has it NOT been for democrats? With Biden, it’s maybe close—without Biden, say hello to Fascism.
Stump gave his regular week in-week out pack of lies, which neither fooled, nor swayed ANYONE. One debate and the proven Winner should bow down to the fascist Loser? Nuh uh. Listen to Gavin Newsom, a man who knows the score.
I will say that President Biden needs to use whatever throat spray or nebulizer professional singers use, and maybe find someone who teaches Alexander Technique to strengthen his voice.
The orange, convicted felon who is a deranged sociopath had his meds administered at the proper time and dosage, but that didn’t keep him from lying; it just made him lie more clearly.
Didn’t Obama have a terrible first debate once upon a time?
He’s not “about to die”, he just did poorly in a non-fact checked debate against a fire hose of lies.
Biden blew it last night. Hard to say, but he did. So now he has a summer of campaigning and meeting with world leaders to do to rehab his image. I think he will do so. (BB, that was me that commented on his debate cramming – it didn’t work. Seemed instead to have caused confusion)
BUT, how about a touch of fact checking? CNN
The video attached to that linked CNN fact check is priceless.
Personally, I don’t want to hear another drop of Drop-Out-Joe-ism without a SOLUTION to winning this election to follow it. No winning solution? Go wait in the truck.
We must focus not just on the fact that he lied, but the existential danger in those lies.
Somewhere I read last night a reminder that it was decided that Hillary won all 3 debates vs trump… didn’t matter.
It is summertime… the real work will begin in Sept. as Jack has reminded us.
To put it in perspective I think of being on an airplane. The flight attendant comes down the aisle with her food cart and, eventually; parks it beside my seat. “Can I interest you in the chicken?” she asks. “Or would you prefer the platter of shit with bits of broken glass in it?
To be undecided in this election is to pause for a moment and then ask how the chicken is cooked.
—David Sedatis
The media drumbeat about “the undecided” is a just a total crock.
today’s meme…
Oh, and AP debunks Dumbass’ suggestion that he offered and Pelosi refused 10,000 NG troops on 1/6.
Imagine SFB lying. I’m shocked.
Larry Sabato makes a good point: “Now he has to do a lot of unscripted appearances and interviews to show last night was abnormal. If he doesn’t we can assume it was normal for him.”
‘The Movement to Convince Biden to Not Run Is Real’ — Politico… https://politi.co/3zePWxl
“Alarmed by Biden’s debate showing, some senior Democrats look to Schumer, Jeffries and Jill Biden to urge the president to rethink his campaign.”
When faced with a lying fascist who has already lost to the Democrat once….why do democrats ALWAYS want to go on the attack……to attack the Democrat?
”Politico” is a great source now? What’s wrong with pointing out that Politico is full of shit?
it was worst-case scenario bad, sturge
we don’t need another bader-ginsburg situation, in the moment we were saying some cute “RBG” puns, now we’re losing every case SCotUS takes
It’s so easy to find people who want to point at all the flaws and problems. Those people are easy to find. They make parades of them to go on tv just to point out flaws and problems. JUST ONCE…..I’d for them to speak to a solution. Just one little bitty solution. No…..it’s just so comfy to sit in the arm chair pointing out problems. we’re faced with a lying fascist turd.
Quick! Attack the Democrat!
Ok…..who’s the replacement?
Newsom? So we get a nonstop barrage about California and Pelosi? Harris? So we get what they will level at her? Hillary?
If not Biden, who?
I’d like a clue to the identity of this champion, waiting in the wings to spring fully armed from th head of Zeus.
Newsome
Michelle but she won’t do it
Hm… who else can win the most important national election ever on short notice hmmmmmmmmmmmm
The GOP should also replace their candidate with one that’s not a compulsively-lying criminal traitor, also
i believe in accentuating the positive but not while my house is on fire
i mean at least it’s Friday, how’s that? 🤷♂️ ✌️ 🇺🇸
Biden does need to get out and about unless he can’t. One thing that bothers me at present is that he seems to be displaying symptoms of ischemia which can be transient until it’s not.
Well it all merely re-enforces my little pet theory that human DNA contains the seeds of Civil War in any group, large or small and humans will never overcome the need. (Even had one on the Trailmix)
Remember kennedy and Jimmy Carter? Bush v Gore? How the democrats let themselves be ripped asunder by internecine strife ? How nice to see it rear its yoogly head again.
Well, no immunity decision today, but decisions that keep homeless people from camping in certain areas; the Chevron decision that said courts have to defer to agencies for interpretation of vague statutes, rather than rely on the expertise of the agencies to decide whether the agency is complying; limited the scope of obstruction of official proceedings by a narrow reading that could cause the dismissal of some of the 1/6 cases and one other case. Next cases (last of the term) will be Monday.
Yes, out and about is where Joe needs to be, with broad coverage of that by the campaign.
Newsome’s time will come unless I miss my guess, but I don’t see the party changing horses in mid stream. If I had to place a bet I’d bet he will be the nominee in 2028.
Not advocating this but I can imagine a scenario where 6 weeks of campaigning to an open convention in mid-august could be an invigorating prospect for Democrats, showcasing what a deep bench they actually have and sucking the oxygen out of the Trump campaign.
I live in SC. I know all about stupid people.
The only way the Fascist wins is if he can split the democrats. His only hope.
Say these undecideds and whatnot have 7 to 8 weeks of democrats chewing on one another. Taking sides against the likes of Newsom, Harris, and Clyburn.
Or what if Joe drops out at a perfect time and the ticket of Harris—Newsom proceeds.
Darn…..2 Californians.
Sturg, I agree that is not what Dems want, or at least we shouldn’t, but Andrea the Breathless is hard at work “questioning” how Joe can survive last night and who should replace him. I’m not sure how a bad night at the podium should have a bigger effect on Joe’s campaign than a 34 count guilty verdict and sentencing should have on Dumbass’, unless voters really don’t give a shit about having a felon as president.
I don’t get it. Biden is fired up and ready to go in Raleigh rally right now. Completely different person than last night.
Cannon is beginning to show her true colors. And we thought the delays were the gambit. Au contraire, Pierre. WaPo.
He may not need to pardon himself after all if she keeps going down this road.
Great Raleigh speech that now needs to be repeated as close to daily as possible!
48 million viewers. Most Watched Program In CNN’s History https://mediaite.com/a/rzjvp
he was stuttering a bit which likely means auditory processing issues i’d guess because of studio/mic setup
putting an 83 year old on a 60sec timer ain’t ideal either
this too…
the good news for me is that i can start using “Jake Tapper” in punchlines again cuz he made a joke of his career last night
ok forcing myself to shut up, pardon
Where was this guy last night? Biden: “I don’t walk as easy as I used to. I don’t speak as smoothly as I used to… I know how to tell the truth. I know right from wrong. I know how to do this job…I know like millions of Americans know; when you get knocked down you get back up!”
Video .. https://x.com/cspan/status/1806744269752811928?t=KHbbgRtT7KdYnSkS6t2mNA&s=19
“Remember kennedy and Jimmy Carter? Bush v Gore? How the democrats let themselves be ripped asunder by internecine strife ? “
sturge, yep it’s the DNA, Democratic Naysaying Assholes, every time we’ve lost…. i’m still upset about what happened to hubert humphrey, to say nothing of how they trashed hillary…. thanks to the DNA we’ve had to endure nixon, reagan, bush and the rump.
change horses in a midstream full of sharks, gators and piranha??? no way, not even if the old horse is a bit lame, odds are he can still get you out of there.
Exactly, Bink. It was not Joe’s element, not this time. His people should’ve known that. Perfect out for them would’ve been refusing to share an equal stage with a convicted criminal.
Joe was great in Raleigh this afternoon, using a teleprompter. I feel like I did years ago when I was drinking and did or said something hurtful, stupid, or dangerous. I mean I wish we could get a do-over and delete last night. I almost got physically sick during that debacle. But Joe got back on the horse and rode straight and upright today. Long may Joe run. Steve Bannon is reporting to prison on Monday. Maybe Trump can be his bunkie when sentencing day happens, very soon.
Biden’s TikTok influencers are out in force. Here’s a good one..
https://www.tiktok.com/t/ZPREU8BWe/
-Joe Biden, Promises to Keep, Prologue, writing of his father’s influence
Why do I feel like the String Quartet on the Titanic?
Patd……Yes…….Pres Nixon, Reagan, Bush2, and Bump.
If the shit hits the fan, how does Josh Shapiro/ Gretchen Whitmer sound? As to the Whitmer/Buttigieg problem of dual Michigan residency, hell, easy. One of them move like Cheney did with W.
Watch Shapiro sometime. He’s very presidential.
Panic, panic, panic. Lets nominate Bernie. After all he is the reason we have Biden rather than someone younger. Clyburn panicked and got us in this mess. Face it Biden has always been a shitty campaigner and a fck up in key moments. Situation normal.
Biden is just lucky it is the week before Independence day and not the week before labor day.
Jack
Nancy Pelosi on Trump’s ridiculous claim she’s responsible for J6: “He’s a fool. He thinks I planned my own assassination? He’s sicker than I thought.”
How about a Trump / Clinton rematch? She could offer to be one term while the party develops all the under card of potentials.
Gee, why would Nancy Pelosi be attacking the Fascist instead of Joe Biden?
Mel Brooks is 98 years old today. That is a lot of laughter.
You don’t hear Republicans trying to ditch their felon.
Blue
It’s a Democratic trait. The left attacks the moderate to conservative branches and vice versa as much as the @GOP. They often even use the same arguments.
For the love of might, Dems need to start making more noise about Project 2025, which goes beyond tRUMPsky-ism.
politics is theater and Biden flopped hard, let us all down, **** cheerleading, there are lives at stake
low-info voters being fed the absolute worst headlines ever and it’s not the fault of rank-and-file Democrats, it’s Team Biden’s fault, full stop
I just detest Our Revolution for trodding on Biden. Republicans never do this; they circle the wagons. Look what happened to Al Franken.
Orange Adolf lied, fear mongered, and trash talked. No policy. No positivity. He’s lowlife scum.
Like attracts like.
Turds of a feather.
Yada, yada, yada.
Breaking News: Steve Bannon will have to go to prison Monday after the Supreme Court rejected his final effort to stave off a four-month sentence for contempt of Congress. nyti.ms/3znLEE0
Olbermann
…to one obvious question: “Is it too late to replace Biden?” There are three answers, the most important of which is: if you do, you trade a still likely victory over evil for certain defeat. No would-be replacement comes within 10 points of Trump in polling. It’s that simple.
https://people.com/supreme-court-overturns-chevron-deference-8663396
“The “Chevron deference” has long been the backbone of how corporations are regulated. The new ruling strips federal agencies of their power to determine what’s best for Americans.”
“On Friday, June 28, the court ruled 6-3 in favor of overturning the “Chevron deference,” a backbone principle for how the federal government keeps corporations in check. Chevron is the practice by which federal courts defer to federal agencies when sorting out ambiguities in a law.”
Without the Chevron deference, experts warn that judges — and not federal agencies themselves — could determine certain environmental regulations.
“If you uproot Chevron, what you’re doing is … saying the agency tasked with doing something — let’s say, controlling pollution, or improving K-12 education — they can go ahead and do what they think is best, but if someone doesn’t like what they did, and they bring the agency to court, there’s no assurance the court will side with the agency,” says Moffa.
Effing chaos monsters! They don’t need no stinkin’ regulations.
New York Times editorial board, voters “cannot be expected to ignore what was instead plain to see: Mr. Biden is not the man he was four years ago.”
To Serve His Country, President Biden Should Leave the Race https://www.nytimes.com/2024/06/28/opinion/biden-election-debate-trump.html?smid=nytcore-android-share
President Biden is back up on the horse!
I love POTUS Joe!
New York Times:
NYT has been attempting to bring about Joe’s abdication for a long time.
How does it serve the country if no alternate candidate comes close to Biden’s polling numbers? What of VP Harris? Everyone seems pretty itchy to trash her, too. No! No! No!
Circle the wagons around President Biden AND attack tRUMPsky via Project 2025. Folks seem to be willing to buy his orange BS and overlook his character. They need to know what THEY will lose. They need to understand how the ultra-wealthy will continue to have tax cuts, Social Security will be jeopardized, and nothing will be regulated except women’s bodies.
Seeing today’s clip, I note that Joe also is an extrovert and I wonder if the lack of audience energy affected him adversely. The lighting last night was harsh too, made him look washed out. Today better on both counts.
The lighting was no friend to Orange Man either, he was oily and iridescent. The old pompadour is now a poop-adour.
Ellen Barkin
1h
Hey fairweather Dems…I’m outside of Stonewall where President Biden is raising the roof. Maybe you can borrow some of his 80 yr old fight. #StandByYourMan
Attack the Right People 101
@MaryLTrump
·
18h
I was proud to be a surrogate for team Biden/Harris tonight but was deeply disheartened by the egregious abdication of journalistic responsibility we saw on that debate stage. Donald doesn’t need any favors.
lol now y’all believe the polls
Attack the Right People 101
StillRidinWithBiden24 So the NYT Editorial Board is calling for Biden to drop out? Trump is a convicted felon who organized a terrorist attack on our Capitol and stood on the debate stage and lied all night but they don’t call on HIM to drop out? FOH
Let’s see how veterans and union workers and women feel about the orange fascist v President Biden.
The debate is over. We have video of tRUMPsky lying, trash talking and fear mongering. That will make good ads, too, when compared with the facts.
I don’t place much trust in polls, but I certainly do trust Mr Olbermann’s opinion. Even more so since he appears to agree with me on most things political.
Attack the right people
The folks ready to dump the Prez (and, presumably, the VP) are being met with a backlash they did not imagine. That, coupled with POTUS Joe’s strong showing in the hours since the debate, are proving that he has staying power.
Suggestion: Hammer away on Project 2025 if you really want to be helpful, and back the hell offa Biden!
Urban: Do you wish you didn’t endorse him?
Kinzinger: No. I’m proud of standing against the habitual liar who lies about everything from January 6th to his golf game
Attack the right people
Rachel Bitecofer’s Xttr. I don’t do Xttr, but I can read them when they pop up. I agree with anybody named Rachel, for personal reasons.
Oh boy….i seem to have learned how to do that.
Sturgeone – that is not the first time such a coincidence has happened. If I remember I will try to do a search later on.
Are we still freaking out over Joe having a rough start of the show? I am not freaking out. It is not the age of him that should be an issue. The overall issue is we are at a point that we do not have a Dem challenger in position to take on sfb or any other white supremacist or white nationalist or koch team or christian fascist movement. And that is to win whatever seat is in contention.
Well, at least one more.
@ltgrusselhonore
#Democrats Please stop Pissing on yourself , it is what it is ! The other guy is a lying convicted felon awaiting another court appearance next week! The #MAGA Republicans went to court with him ! Get your Azz off the ground and circle the wagons, save our democracy help get out the Vote !“ In war you will lose a battle , stay focus, learn, adapt, and overcome focus on winning the war “ Stop beating your guy and focus on the lying criminal
POTUS Joe might just get a delayed bounce out of this! C’mon union and military members. C’mon women. C’mon folks who care about Social Security and Medicare. C’mon anyone who doesn’t want to live in what will feel like muddy Rusher!
Ah, Ratshit.
RIP Martin Mull.
Martin Mull’s talk show satire was a hoot
@ElieNYC
·
52m
Listening to white folks blithely talk about pushing Biden off a cliff, skipping over Harris, and trotting out some white person like ain’t nobody gonna notice that is some *hilarious* shit.
School’s back in session.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gish_gallop
That right there is as well as I’ve heard it put.
One of my favorite Heathers.
The term was coined in 1994 by anthropologist Eugenie Scott, who named it after American creationist Duane Gish and argued that Gish used the technique frequently when challenging the scientific fact of evolution.[1]
https://nypost.com/2024/06/28/us-news/trump-biden-debate-a-fundraising-boon-for-both-candidates/
“The Biden campaign on Friday touted $14 million raised on debate day and the morning after, noting that it saw its single best hour of fundraising – between 11 p.m. and midnight – since the president announced his run for re-election last April.”
And, unlike Orange Adolf, none of it will go to pay legal fees!
good episode
https://www.npr.org/podcasts/510053/on-point
“The ‘Pod Save America’ guide to saving democracy
Post-presidential debate, the hosts of the ‘Pod Save America’ share debate analysis informed by their own White House and political campaign experience. Plus, their guide to saving democracy ahead of the 2024 election.”
i guess i should be listening to “Pod Save America”
There’s a car hood on the ground by my car. Glad I didn’t park any closer. I think it’s just rain for the rest of the night. I’ve never seen so much lightning for such a long period of time.
Hope w’jack is OK
“i feel bad for tigers in zoos. Imagine being in prison your whole life being constantly visited by sandwiches”
-Jacob Samuel
If it was supposedly everybody else’s job to fact check the Felon except the Felon’s, then it is now a given he’s permitted, indeed expected to lie. With impunity.
NEW THREAD by Craig our fearless leader