69 thoughts on “Impeach”

  8. Correct me if I’m wrong, but watching the first of these opening statements, it appears that Democrats like the concept of impeachment of Donald Trump and Republicans don’t. Beyond that, blah blah blah blah blah.

  9. GOP are goblins yelling at the Whos of Whoville because their head Grinch got caught stealing presents. What a way to slither into history. 

  11. I don’t know about Pat, but Blue and I could well be distantly (very) related royals as I’m connected through the Boleyns and Howards due to Matthew Howard moving to the New World to help settle Maryland.  

    I tried to watch the hearings but gave it up a inflicting bodily harm on Republicans started to sound like a good idea.  

  15. The R’s are reminding me a little bit of the saying in the country courthouses in Alabama where the understanding is that if you have the facts on your side you argue the facts, if you have the law on your side, you argue the law, and if you have neither, you argue the bible, except that arguing the bible (although I do expect it to come up at some point in FB posts that T is being crucified just like Jesus) they are just shouting.
     

  16. trump died for my sins ??? They aren’t going to tell me that, are they ? That’d be so much like fulfilling Revelation, even bozos like gohmert might notice. 
     
    Well . . .  maybe not gohmert, but you get the idea.

  17. …tried to listen, can’t bear hearing any more lies and obfuscation from Republican representatives.  It takes a toll.

    …also, disappointed that Democrats aren’t pursuing an article for witness intimidation, as the President engaged in that conduct numerous times and in plain sight on public channels.

  24. I do know that 14% of the population is functionally illiterate.  Apparently they all now work as Republicans in Congress or attend Donald Trump rallies. 

  25. Poobah, I share your puzzlement about the lack of argument against the repub process argument. With an arkload of defied subpoenas and refusals to testify from administration witnesses complaints of lack of due process and lack of evidence  fall a bit flat. 
    Interesting about MJ. I’d like to see more from him(?).  

  26. revisiting bink’s & pogo’s conversation a few threads ago about impeachment and prez pardon power.  there are just days left for trump (with the help of pence) to escape being indicted when he leaves office.  that is if by a broad brush of white wash such a pardon can cover all of his crimes, federal and state, and he can be cleansed forever of same.

    NYTimes oped by law prof redish wrote this:

    In enacting the pardon power, Alexander Hamilton wrote, the framers intended to place this authority in the hands of “a single man of prudence and good sense.” But constitutional history is also dominated by the framers’ obsession with the prevention of tyranny; and of the three branches, the most likely to degenerate into tyrannical rule is the executive, which is headed by the president, the military’s commander in chief.

    It is likely for that reason that the framers inserted an important qualification concerning a process that has dominated the news for months: The president could exercise the pardon power, “except in cases of impeachment.” In its narrowest form, both textually and historically, this means that the president cannot pardon an executive or judicial officer — including himself — from impeachment conviction. But perhaps this reading doesn’t go far enough, for the president is capable of undermining the impeachment check in indirect but equally dangerous ways.

    the good prof goes on about abusing the power by suborning witnesses and congressmen to avoid impeachment in the first place.

    another BUT to argue is  that that phrase “except in cases of impeachment” might also mean to nullify (even if only impeached but not convicted) trump’s power to pardon for the rest of his term.   this argument is kinda analogous to when a witness is impeached and his testimony completely thrown out. 

     

     

  27. I still think there is a chance that the twit will try to save himself, his property and whatever fortune really exists by doing a Nixon and resigning before impeachment.     that is as long as pence is still around to pardon him.

    but don’t bet on it.  it’s just as likely that he’ll declare martial law and become dictator in chief with loyal MAGAts cheering him on. 

  29. Nevada demoralized by all-white Democratic top tier.

    This truly upsets me as well.  I won’t vote for any of these top four in WA primary which will be too late.  Still hanging in to get Klobuchar with Castro or Booker, but only because I’m not quite brave enough to hope for Klobuchar/Harris.  Of course two male tickets have been screwing over the nation for 240 years … maybe it is time for the ladies to fix the mess they’ve made.

     

  30. Nah, pat. He knows he won’t be convicted in the Senate so he’s not going anywhere. Oh, and he has no power to pardon for state charges or convictions. 
    McMertle is talking about a trial without witnesses or evidence. I guess he has every confidence that Roberts, who will preside over the trial, is as afraid of SFB as he is. Maybe I am a bit naive and optimistic but I doubt that Roberts would be willing to have the spectre of a sham trial hung around his neck like the ancient mariner’s albatross when the story of his career as Chief Justice is written. 

  31. Pogo…  I may be a bit naive and optimistic too.  Chief Roberts did save the ACA from being totally destroyed by the Republicans.  That gives me a teeny tiny bit of hope that he will do the right thing concerning the Senate trial.
     
    We’ll see…

  32. pogo, so that phrase “except in cases of impeachment” only refers to his ability/inability to pardon any of those who were involved in the impeachment process including himself with regard to impeachment label?

    like the big dawg, he’s still branded throughout history as impeached even if he is acquitted by senate.  the senate could still vote a mild slap on the wrist such as “tsk tsk, Donald, you naughty boy” but I doubt they will do anything other than cast their vote and sneak out of town like shamed dogs with hanged heads and tails tucked under.

  33. Jamie, no matter who is at the debate as long as booker and castro remain on the primary tickets, dems still have a chance to cast votes for something other than white bread.   they may even be better off NOT on the debate stage if it devolves into a circular shooting.  didn’t the twit use that gimmick last time by holding his own show with vets charity?

  34. Not clear to me what role the Chief Justice plays. Constitution only says he presides, while Senate has sole power. Seems that means he can’t do anything the Senate doesn’t agree with.

  35. The (only) russian aircraft carrier is on fire and burning very nicely.  It will be out of action for a very long time if it does not sink or is scuttled.  Leaving me to wonder how the russians will be able to bomb civilians from a aircraft carrier.  Will that mean SFB loans one of the U.S. carriers to Putin?

  36. Poobah, I’m not sure I agree with that. While the Senate has the sole power to try articles of impeachment, the presiding judge should be vested with the inherent power to manage the proceedings. I would think that any Initial rulings would have to go through the judge to be voted on by the Senate as a body, so if he felt the need for evidence and testimony, I believe he could direct the respective prosecuting side and defense side to present their cases. But then again I’m guessing. I suspect that there are probably some rules regarding how these things would proceed that someone who has more time than I have today would be able to look for.

  37. Patd

    Yes I’m hopeful about the ticket placement except that Nevada is a caucus state.  In 2016 the Bernie crowd made a mess of that one.  Let us hope Booker and Castro have enough funds to last to Super Tuesday

    WA was so bad they had to change state law to have only the Primary to count.

     

  38. My new favorite ticket is Amy-Cory
    And someone posted that Cory Booker would not have a first lady   I think his long-time girlfriend Rosario Dawson might disagree

  40. no 1st or 2nd ladies in Booker-Buttigieg administration unless sen. cory some way formalizes his relationship by marrying or by exec. order or proclamation.  we would, however, have a 2nd laddie with mayor pete’s husband. 

    if Jamie’s ticket gets in, we would have both a 1st and 2nd laddie.

  42. in case we never see or hear from chris again, this may be the reason:

    the guardian:

    A leading host on Fox News, a conservative network notorious for its loyalty to the White House, has lambasted Donald Trump for mounting the most direct attack on press freedom in American history.
    Chris Wallace, widely admired for breaking ranks from Fox colleagues by putting tough questions to administration officials, delivered his most stinging critique yet of the US president at an event celebrating the first amendment.
    “I believe that President Trump is engaged in the most direct sustained assault on freedom of the press in our history,” Wallace said to applause at the Newseum, a media museum in Washington, on Wednesday night.
    “He has done everything he can to undercut the media, to try and delegitimise us, and I think his purpose is clear: to raise doubts when we report critically about him and his administration that we can be trusted. Back in 2017, he tweeted something that said far more about him than it did about us: ‘The fake news media is not my enemy. It is the enemy of the American people.’”
    Wallace recalled that retired admiral Bill McRaven, a navy Seal for 37 years, had described Trump’s sentiment as maybe “the greatest threat to democracy in my lifetime” because, unlike even the Soviet Union or Islamic terrorism, it undermines the US constitution.
    The veteran broadcaster added: “Let’s be honest, the president’s attacks have done some damage. A Freedom Forum Institute poll, associated here with the Newseum, this year found that 29% of Americans, almost a third of all of us, think the first amendment goes too far. And 77%, three quarters, say that fake news is a serious threat to our democracy.”
    Wallace is a rare dissenting voice at the Rupert Murdoch-owned Fox News, where opinion hosts such as Sean Hannity and Laura Ingraham are fiercely pro-Trump. Longtime anchor Shep Smith, who was also praised for his independence, stepped down in October and warned that “intimidation and vilification of the press is now a global phenomenon. We don’t have to look far for evidence of that.”
    Wallace, son of distinguished journalist Mike Wallace, conducts some of the sharpest grillings of any of America’s long running Sunday politics shows. When he recently took House minority whip Steve Scalise to task, Trump responded with a tweet that called Wallace “nasty” and “obnoxious”.
    But at Wednesday’s event, a farewell to the Newseum which is closing down after nearly 12 years at its current location, Wallace also warned the media against overreach. “I think many of our colleagues see the president’s attacks, his constant bashing of the media as a rationale, as an excuse to cross the line themselves, to push back, and that is a big mistake,” he said.
    “I see it all the time on the front page of major newspapers and the lead of the evening news: fact mixed with opinion, buzzwords like ‘bombshell’ and ‘scandal’. The animus of the reporter and the editor as plain to see as the headline.”

  43. Seems to me the Founders just wanted to include the Judiciary branch in some way but left it unclear how much control a chief justice should actually have over a Senate trial.

  44. “The Senate shall have the sole Power to try all Impeachments…. When the President of the United States is tried, the Chief Justice shall preside.” That doesn’t leave much room for the Chief Justice other than to sit there and look pretty. 

    “Sole power” is unequivocal language, had they meant power to be shared in some way with the chief justice they should have said so.

  47. Gym Jordan…lolol…perfect!  I’m so SICK of hearing the whining, LOUD, bitches!  Especially the ones with the southern twang!  GAG!

  48. I believe parliamentary rules in the colonies and our new republic were quite similar to what we have today. Just to make sure I’ve ordered Lex Parliamentaria Americana.

  50. After watching The Report, about Bush/Cheney/Yoo torture, I watched Vice, about Cheney.  Both will make your skin CRAWL!!  Vice was weird & quirky.  However, Christian Bale was amazing. I think it was too kind to Cheney, a  horrible, scary person!!!! And DC is full of men like that!!!  *shivers* 

  51. I’ve always presumed that the Chief Justice was there to 1. keep order, 2. advise on legal matters (the founders imagined a legislature of farmers and merchants), such as the proper order of argument and investigation, examination in chief, cross, redirect, and summation, 3. to point out when the testimony is immaterial, redundant, or hearsay, and to point out when counsel is leading or badgering a witness or engaging in irrelevant hortatory.
    Iow, to make certain that the accused has a fair trial, even in the Senate. Maybe all of my assumptions are wrong. Maybe Moscow mitch has a Moscow type trial in mind, as trump may be seen to have worn out his utility. I dunno.

  52. Just saw that Super Shuttle is pulling out of LAX at the end of the year.  It states competition from the uber and lyft drivers are the problem.  I do know that I care little for Uber or Lyft.  Most of the time I find the prices the same as a taxi or Super Shuttle.  I have never had a problem getting a cab, but have nothing but delays and lost drivers with Uber and Lyft.  Over the last fifty years I have had only a couple of cab drivers do anything real bad.  More often they have taken my instructions to get me to the airport fast to heart.  Sometimes driving the wrong way on one way streets, or even a sidewalk or two.  Lyft or Uber drivers have a habit of being lost even finding me, including in major cities they should be familiar with. 
     
    The Constitution was a new way of looking at governing, albeit a mix of other forms, but the first time something like this was put into action.  The three branches of government, equal, but not equal, all trying to determine where each fits in America.  The Chief Justice could be looked at in two ways.  One is a the judge of the impeachment trial, but not the decider.  The other is as the decider.  I tend to go with the concept that the Chief Justice is the decider, especially in this case.  But, it looks like Moscow Mitch is going to make sure Putin is real proud of him, maybe give him an apartment in Moscow, for going out of his way to let SFB go free.

  53. To paraphrase Rep. Raskin, 

    From the Energy Department to the Justice Department, from State Department to the White House, Mr trump has pulled down an Iron Curtain across his administration.

  55. Does a witness really need to know what she is being charged with before she gives up subpoena’d documents ? gohmert tells us so. 
     
    baylor law school grad. Who took his tests for him ?

  56. Rep. Chabot (R-OH) just said, “maybe so many people shouldn’t be listening to the President’s calls, and if you are, shut up about it”.

    Rep. Gohmert (R-TX) called elected Democrats pursuing a legal remedy codified by the U.S. Constitution “tyrannical”, obviously hoping his constituents don’t understand what that means.

    Rep. Murcasell-Powell (D-FL): “My sister is a yoga teacher- she doesn’t contort the way these Republicans try to”.

  59. Seems to me any powers the chief justice wields over the trial would have to be ceded to him by the Senate in advance. Again, giving the Senate “sole power” is unavoidable. 

  61. Ok, well if you can’t answer that, can someone tell me if i should eat this 6-month-old opened half-portion of raw ground beef i found in the freezer?  Because, i am considering it.
     
    This could be your big chance to get rid of me.

    Nevermind, it’s been run through committee and has been decided by unanimous consent to tempt the Gods. Our findings will be summarized in a report to be submitted at a later time.

  63. iknorite

    …finished the Baked Ziti of Death, went to make garlic bread, and the bread is moldy.  i just bought it!😭

  64. Baked Ziti of Death:

    Half-pound 6-month old questionable ground beef
    4 mushrooms
    1 onion
    2 carrots
    3 segments of a celery stalk
    1 can crushed tomatoes
    1 cup italian style blended cheese
    1 pkg of penne pasta
    3 tablespoons trendy Avacodo oil 
    2 cloves garlic
    italian seasoning
     
    Boil water for penne pasta and cook for 12 minutes or until soft (past al-dente).
    In 3-gallons pot, add trendy avacado oil and set to medium high heat.  After 2 Republican lies and/or obfuscations (approximately 30 seconds) add the onions, chopped. Try not to mess with them too much.  Once any brown color is perceived, mix with a wooden spoon and add carrots.  Once Republicans mention the “Fast & Furious” investigation, add celery.  After trimming freezer-burned parts of old ground-beef and as soon as you hear Doug Collins (R-GA) cry like a baby in the key of Am, add to pot and brown, turning frequently.   Once all of the beef is mostly browned, add mushrooms, still stirring frequently. Add garlic half-way through that process (the gentleman’s time will have expired). Add italian seasoning.
     
    Add can of crushed tomatoes and 3/4 can of leaded-water from the tap, delivered by an aging infrastructure.  Bring to simmer.
     
    Add cooked penne pasta to a 9×13” casserole dish until 3/4 full.  Distribute all of the sauce you made over the pasta.  Cover with Italian-style shredded cheese.  Place casserole dish on a cookie sheet so your oven doesn’t get detritus all over it.  Bake in 350F oven for approximately 25 minutes until cheese is golden brown or a Constitutional crisis occurs.  Serve with moldy garlic bread.

  65. 1. Cheese is pre-digested rotted milk, and definitely unsafe to eat. My bypass surgery removed about 25 kilos of the stuff from the arteries around my heart.
     
    2. If the ground beef has been frozen all this time it should be okay to eat. The fat in it may have developed some off flavors as even frozen fats do, as they turn into a cheese-like horror.  Strong flavoring will help hide the taste, which is why tomatoes and peppers became so popular in the first place. 
     
    3. Good luck; we’re all pulling for you.

  66. I think the House vote should be anonymous, so that Moscow Mitch can learn how it’s done.  Can pence ask for a vote on anonymous voting, or is he only permitted to break the tie ?

  67. I mean, if it’s 65 to 33, can pence make the 2/3 ? Or, if it’s 65 to 32 can he vote to kill our fond hope ?

  68. x-r,  wouldn’t that put pence in a conflict of interest?  vote yae to remove and make himself prez or vote nae and  confirm his unfitness for office of anything.

Comments are closed.