74 thoughts on “How A Political Party Commits Suicide”

  1. you missed a few.  in case suicide not successful, some stakes they can self-drive thru their own non-existent heart:

    allow government shutdown

    let children’s health program CHIP and the children thereby affected die

    do nothing about daca and deport more than 800,000 dreamers illegally brought to usa as children

  2. just think, all the above listed can be accomplished before their holiday break.  merry Christmas, happy Hanukkah,  eid, Kwanzaa and festivus ,  suckers!

  3. Please, wake up!

    Dems have done a horrible job of explaining what THEY WILL do.

    (Can Nancy Pelosi just retire, already? She is increasingly inept and, occasionally, despicable.)

    Also, not enough has been done to shine a light on the Repugz’ pile-o-poop tax plan.

    It should be so easy for Dems.  Sadly, they are relying on their own echo chamber of disgust at Donny.  That won’t win seats.

  4. and then there are interesting things like this happening to add to the confusion.

    from wapo

    The Washington Post on Monday published a report about a woman who falsely claimed Roy Moore sexually assaulted her as a teenager — and who appeared to work with Project Veritas, an organization that uses deceptive tactics and secretly recorded conversations in an effort to embarrass its targets.

    Shortly after the investigation was published, Project Veritas founder James O’Keefe tweeted a video of what he called his “confrontation” with one of the authors of The Post investigation, Aaron C. Davis. The video was heavily edited, a tactic for which Project Veritas has drawn criticism.

    The Post filmed the entire encounter.

    Davis and another Post reporter, along with two video reporters, went to the Project Veritas offices in Mamaroneck, N.Y., on Monday morning to try to determine whether the woman, Jaime T. Phillips, worked there. They watched as she walked into the office. O’Keefe, who appeared minutes later, declined to answer questions. He invited Davis back for an interview shortly after noon.

    In the full version of the video, O’Keefe repeatedly declined to answer questions about the woman and her affiliation with Project Veritas. The organization has previously targeted mainstream media outlets such as CNN, which it accuses of being biased.

    […]

    In a series of interviews with Post reporters over two weeks, Phillips shared a false story about an alleged sexual relationship in 1992 with Moore, the Republican U.S. Senate candidate in Alabama. She said the relationship led to an abortion when she was 15. During the interviews, she repeatedly pressed Post reporters to give their opinions on the whether her claims could affect Moore’s candidacy if she went public.

    The Post did not publish an article based on her unsubstantiated account. When Post reporters confronted her last Wednesday with inconsistencies in her story, as well as an Internet posting that raised doubts about her motivations, she insisted that she was not working with any organization that targets journalists.

  5. msnbc:
    Can Michael Flynn be trusted in the Mueller investigation?
    Rep. Adam Schiff, D-Calif., discusses what Michael Flynn could share with Special Counsel Robert Mueller and if Flynn can be trusted regarding Russia and the 2016 Trump campaign. Rep. Schiff also discusses a meeting at Mar-a-Lago between fmr. CIA Director and figure in Mueller probe James Woolsey and President Trump.

    Schiff says about woolsey trump meet “it’s quite inexplicable”

  6. Both Political Parties are in a drudge. This is our own 1850s, when luminaries (?) such as Fillmore, Pierce & Buchanan flickered forth a dull light. blueINdallas is correct in stating the Dems’ impotence for giving a reason to exist other than We ain’t them. There is no there there. #45’s Presidency is the gift that keeps on giving gumdrops, lollipops & gingerbread hourly. Yet …. the opposition goes thud. To quote the great Peter Cook: You fill me with inertia.

     

  7. surprise surprise…. whodathought?

    newsweek:

    President Donald Trump donated to an agency with a history of trying to take down liberal organizations, an agency that is now accused of trying to dupe the Washington Post with a fake Roy Moore claim in an undercover operation. 

  8. the guardian:

    The US supreme court, which has avoided major gun cases for seven years, on Monday declined to hear a National Rifle Association-backed challenge to a 2013 state ban on assault weapons enacted in Maryland after the Connecticut elementary school massacre.

    The court also declined to hear a second gun-related case in which a Florida man convicted of openly carrying a firearm on the street sought to challenge that state’s ban on such activity.

    […continues…]

  9. it does seem like we’re not seeing the same level of pushback in ads, grassroots etc. from Dems on this tax bill as we saw in the health care fight

  10. The issue that won’t go away… I’ve been debating whether to weigh in on this again but after seeing Craig’s zero tolerance policy evoked yesterday I begin to worry that the pendulum is going to swing back so far that it will set women back several decades. As someone who was in the trenches in the 70s & 80s with battered women and rape victims, we fought long and hard to change laws and perceptions. As recently as 40 years ago there were laws on the books about how big a stick could be used to beat a woman. There were no laws protecting women from violent men. We went to court with women who were bruised and bleeding and begged judges to believe them and to issue restraining orders. We gave workshops at police stations to teach policemen (yes, they were almost all men) how to treat women and how to talk to victims so as not to re-victimize them. The fact that we still have shelters for battered women and rape crisis hotlines shows that we still have far to go but now we have an atmosphere that is making a mockery of everything thousands of women like me spent years working on. Now if a woman cries foul in any form they have the power to end a man’s career. Some of these are deserved, some are not. A lot of the ludicrous statements lately are being debunked, but the damage is still being done. Now a woman doesn’t have to “cry rape” as they were accused of years ago. Simple everyday male boorish behavior is being thrown out there along side sexual assault, acts against children and actual job threatening sexual harassment in the workplace. I’ve seen lines as stupid as he hugged me a long time or he had his hand on my shoulder as he was talking to me being reported as sexual misconduct. This article from the NY Times articulates a lot of what I’ve been feeling lately. I don’t want to see us go back to the days where a cop sneers down at a woman who is covered in bruises and asks why did she do XYZ to provoke such an attack or a rape victim is asked why she went to XYZ with the guy in question if she didn’t want him to XYZ? My fear is that after this new rush to judgment, putting all the misconduct eggs in one basket, coloring them all the same color and using the same brush strokes, that basket is bound to eventually collapse under its own dubious weight. When that happens everything will fall back to the status quo where women are not taken seriously and male power goes back to its exalted position. Serious allegations must be taken seriously, but seeing all idiotic male behavior as equal will only diminish the actual criminal complaints of women who have been victimized by men. Women do not have to tolerate, or destroy the careers of, boorish men, they can tell them to f— off! Then if the behavior persist they can report it, not complain ten years later when it’s suddenly in vogue to cry foul for every stupid thing a man has ever done! This is helping nobody. I guess I’ll get off the soap box now.

  11. I want to be associated with GrannyM’s 10:00am statement.

    And how does one call for giving Flynn a second chance and yet says zero tolerance on someone who patted a few butts years ago.  That makes zero sense to me.

  12. I do, too. For the ass grabbing pol, a useful, non-violent rejoinder might be, ‘Asshole, that just cost you 100 votes among people I know.’

  13. my point about Flynn, RR, is that he should be encouraged to tell the whole truth, and get some redemption, even if he still does jail time, which he probably should

  14. Count me in with Granny and RR. Granny, stay on that soap box

    This current Reign of Terror must end. Maybe this knee jerk movement will end when the jerk *45 goes; right now, it is damaging the female brand.

    Being jostled  and touched during a photo op is being equated with being raped. I’ve been raped, harassed at work, jostled, and as a teen, leered at and approached by older men. Rape is the worst of those. There is no comparison.

    The Reign of Terror trivializes rape as it magnifies the importance of personal comfort zones. If you “felt” groped, why then …

    Instead of “Believe the Women” we might have “Listen to the Women” or “Listen to One Another” then take each case on its merits.

    I am pleased Franken is remaining in the Senate, and that he didn’t bow to political pressure to resign. If I understood his statement yesterday correctly, he did not concede to groping. The whole thing had all the appearance of an admission of innocence (except for that photo, which was dumb and I doubt we have the full story on that).

  15. granny’s so right about Serious allegations must be taken seriously, but seeing all idiotic male behavior as equal will only diminish the actual criminal complaints of women who have been victimized by men. 

    as was jack’s Are we getting to where all offenses are equal? That we give the death penalty to murders and jay walkers alike?

    the publick stocks (embarrassment, media exposure, censure votes, political ads  and comic ridicule) have their use as well as do shooting at dawn, hanging, prison, jails, fines, loss of job or property, tar and feathering.  the punishment must equal the crime though…. and doesn’t our very own 8th amdmt say something about prohibiting excessive, cruel and unusual penalties?

  16. associated press:

    Top Democratic leaders in Congress have abruptly pulled out of a planned meeting with President Donald Trump after he attacked them on Twitter.

    Trump tweeted early Tuesday that “I don’t see a deal!” with Senate Minority Leader Charles Schumer and top House Democrat Nancy Pelosi.

    Schumer and Pelosi are shooting back with a statement asking for talks with top GOP leaders in Congress.

    They said, “given that the president doesn’t see a deal between Democrats and the White House, we believe the best path forward is to continue negotiating with our Republican counterparts in Congress instead.”

    Congress faces a Dec. 8 deadline to pass stopgap legislation to keep the government open.

    They added, “we don’t have any time to waste.”

  17. Flynn has no reason to come clean if what he says helps Donny enough to get Flynn a pardon.

    Dems didn’t stop the healthcare dump; the people did that, with a bit of air time from the media.

    The money spent on political ads could be put to better use by engaging (and airing) town hall meetigs.  If they run an ad based in a meeting, don’t edit it to death.  It just ends up looking Repug-smarmy.

    As for the plight of women and underlings at the hands of arrogant pervs, even Cokie Roberts doesn’t seem to get it.  Women aren’t saying so what if he made a pass at someone when something worse happened to them, therefore, they’ll support Moore…or that what Al did wasn’t so bad.  I couldn’t believe that was her take on the sitch on Sunday.  People really need to get out of DC for a full year and then come back when they’ve rubbed elbows with the rest of the country.

    I fear that Dems will be shocked when they let this golden opportunity to slip away because they have nothing to offer…or are just piss-poor at explaining  themselves.

     

     

  18. Me too Granny.

    The goopers aka  Grand Ole’ Predators

    do they really think that people don’t know what they are doing?   How is that people who earn less than 10k will pay more while PG pays less.

    And I agree where are the ads?   They just make themselves –teachers versus the owners of private jets?    poverty level earners versus all of PG’s cabinet

  19. Simple standard:  Pinch my ass and get your face slapped.  Date Rape earns jail time.  As with all human behavior, there are degrees of venality and sin.

     

  20. Democrats did so badly in the last elections?   WTF

    They kicked ass all over the place in the elections all over the place

  21. One woman alleges Franken forcibly kissed her on a USO tour and took a sexually suggestive photo while she was sleeping; three other women allege Franken grabbed their buttocks while posing with them for photos during separate campaign events in 2007, 2008 and 2010. Zero tolerance.

  22. Had Dems had an election theme of ending DC corruption, they’d have a majority in the House and Senate today.

  23. I offer a story.

    About six years ago, I was having a conversation with a couple of female colleagues. We were standing in an open walkway between cubicle sections. I realized that we were not only likely bothering co-workers, but also blocking the path for anyone trying to move through.

    “Hey, let’s get a room,” said I.

    The one colleague burst into laughter. The second inhaled audibly, her eyes going wide and round.

    “I beg your pardon,” said she in the I-can’t-believe-you-just-said-that tone.

    Replaying the conversation quickly in my head, I realized what I said. I had innocently meant to suggest that we adjourn the discussion to a nearby conference room. My short hand inadvertently caused offense. I immediately apologized and explained what I meant. I allowed that I should watch my phraseology, neither smiling nor laughing as I said it. But even that remark drew another laugh from the one colleague and an eye roll from the second.

    My offended colleague reported me to HR. I was called to explain, which I did. The one colleague came to my defense, and eventually the second agreed that perhaps she had read more into my comment than I intended.

    I’m still embarrassed to this day, although I did nothing wrong. Still, my offended-in-the-moment colleague was offended.

    I offer my little story to extol the virtues of reporting and investigating allegations. I don’t hold my offended colleague in contempt because she reporting being offended. She didn’t really know me all that well at the time, and didn’t know that I’m just not that guy. So she was bothered and she reported it, as she should have done when faced with what she considered harassment.

    I’m glad I had a chance to explain, and I’m glad cooler heads prevailed. My remark had an unintended meaning when taken completely out of context. I’d hate to think that I could have gotten caught up in a zero tolerance policy.

  24. Lets see a USO performer who can’t keep her facts straight and 3 band wagon jumper against over a 100 people who have worked with Franken over the years in support of him.

    Kinda thin proof there.

    Jack

     

  25. Travis, thanks for sharing. Sounds to me like your situation was ultimately handled appropriately, not ignored, and in the end you were treated fairly.

  26. This argument reminds me of all the white people taking umbrage at the name “Redskins” while most Native Americans could give a shit.  They have more pressing problems to care about.

    Here we have a male taking umbarge over inappropriate male behavior while most women here don’t give a shit.   We have more pressing problems to care about.

  27. Granny, I get what you’re saying but fears of unfair accusations shouldn’t justify ignoring, discounting, or even ridiculing claims against political figures we might like.

  28. Yes I was treated fairly, for which I’m grateful. I’m really not that guy. Although I hold advanced degrees in the art of flirting, I try to be appropriate and respectful. That comes from being raised by a single mom and a younger sister, with a healthy dollop from my grandmother. My buddies all knew where to draw the line with “locker room talk” about girls, because as a big brother I simply wouldn’t tolerate it.

    That’s not to say that I can’t or won’t do wink-wink-nudge-nudge innuendo, just that I’m aware of my audience.

    Still, that brush with a harassment charge was quite sobering. An innocent turn of phrase can lead you down a path you have no intention of going. And it’s why I will always stand in favor of listening and investigating every case on its own merits, and never comparing one instance to another.

  29. craig, it’s not “fears of unfair accusations” some of us are talking about in response to your “zero tolerance” but fears of unfair disparate penalties.  yes there should be NO tolerance, but there should be a gradual severity of punishment to match the gravity of that which is not tolerated.

  30. things we learned in elementary school:

    boy who pulls girl’s pigtails in class is made to sit in corner or write 100 times on the blackboard about his crime

    boy who knocks down girl is sent to principals office

    boy who knocks up girl is expelled

  31. Craig…  I didn’t say that.  It does feel to me that you aren’t listening to the females on this blog that seem to have an overwhelming opinion that differs from your own.  As a female I can tell you that GrannyM’s post is very powerful.  YES…  I am concerned that equating an occasional pinched butt with Roy Moore’s behavior will set back women from being taken seriously.

    OK… that’s my last word on this subject to you….  unless I change my mind 🙂

  32. Conyers needs to go. Franken is in this mire of are these intentional or not; I know what the photo scrum is like, I have had, my own and many others, hands, butts and boobs, bumped, touched and when going to grip a waist end up with a cheek; even had a boob or two in my eye, and mine in someone else’s face.  Clinton (Bill) is a cad and deserves our scorn.  I still think HRC worked out some sort of deal with him.  Wiener is in prison; Dems do tear down bad un’s.

     

  33. Congressional Black Caucus Dems bailing on Conyers plan to argue it’s racist to give Franken a pass. Fasten your seat belts.

  34. Get your popcorn ready.  The little guy with giant ears att the bottom of the thread has the right idea.

    Um, Franken didn’t call anyone into his office while he was in a state of undress.  Smartass grabassery is not the same thing, but he should’ve known better.

  35. When I was a manager for 7 years, twice each year I called the staff together and gave a speech about my zero tolerance policy concerning sexual harassment, detailing a variety of behaviors I would not tolerate, inviting anyone to come to my door if they were made to feel uncomfortable. I learned this from a previous boss. Apparently (I hope) the chilling effect worked because I never heard a single complaint. It’s not a problem if management lays down the law.

  36. Republicans on their way to cut taxes for rich donors and make the middle class pay for it. Hello Midterms!

  37. Never mind he’s the butt of lee Atwater politics……..you’re trying to equate a good man with Roy Moore

  38. Maybe there’s some more of that shit about what people say somewhere……..might say some other shit.

  39. Mr Sturgeone, maybe you could find a more lucrative career as a genuine rock’n’roller to the putin oligarchs !  https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/exclusive-—-colleague-names-putins-daughter-then-withdraws-comments/ar-BBFRJDb?li=AA4Zpp&ocid=spartanntp&fullscreen=true#image=1

  40. While I am indeed a genuine rock n’ roller, I have managed to put aside the things of my youth and concentrate upon the higher mathematics of cabinetry……..

  41. The Minneapolis Stab Harpoon is as close to being a newspaper as we MNs have. There is also the MN Post, which is only available online, and mostly the contributions of actual journalists that said Store Typhoon and the St Paul Prying Ear Press shed to save space for more advertising, and money for more advertising.

    Needless to say, some of the names have been changed to promote the innocent. The innocent being the MN Post

  42. repugs (even some gutterwallowing sexists among them) in the State of Minnesota are happy to join in the shouting for Franken to step down. It has not reached the torch and pitchfork level, but I hear that the local fux tv affiliate has found it necessary to mention the kerfuffle a few times every hour. I’m guessing that the Independent/Swingvote/Suckers might be moved by the perceived smirch upon our fair states escutcheon.

    Asspattery would not normally be considered assbattery here, but as one Minnesotan once observed, The times they are a-cha-angin’. 

  43. I’m not saying Al should get a pass.  I’m saying that what he did is not the same as a sitting Congressman calling someone into his office while he’s half-nekked.  My fear is that he’s the only one who won’t get a pass, while others go unpunished.  Never admit liability. Right, Roy?

     

  44. I don’t understand these excuses contrasting unrelated offenses, arguments that because one is less offensive than the other it should be ignored. Several women saying Franken groped them is certainly less serious than what we’ve heard about Moore or Conyers but that doesn’t mean it should be ignored. And it is indefensible behavior that does not belong in the Senate.

  45. Craig

    We would like to have something resembling a Congress when the purges are done.  Considering the length of the list of probable offenders, it only makes sense to take them in order of severity.  There are probably at least 400 ahead of the fanny pinchers.

  46. This evening I took inventory of my accounts and did my end-of-year charitable giving. If their was one overriding theme in the recipients is that they fight hate and intolerance. Examples are the SPLC, ADL, ADA and a couple of more.

     

  47. Craig

    Yes I would defend a Democrat in the same condition.  But even with fanny pinching has degrees.  I’ve been assaulted with a full blown crotch grab delivered by a nut case while I was climbing stairs and had more than one uninvited “atta girl” fanny slap (see your nearest football field) that were dealt with via “never do that again” lecture.

    Considering how many infidelities, assaults, and sex for jobs are probably present in Congress, concentrating on a relative mild offender who has been chastised only allows the much more serious actions to be equated as harmless.

    Let’s go after the really bad actors and put up a “never again” rule for the minor offenses.

     

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